# GTO Build Quality



## ohmy (Jan 16, 2007)

Before purchasing my GTO, I did my share of reading about it in various car magazines. There were various opinions about the exterior styling but just about every article I've read praised the GTO for being very well put together and having a solid build quality. 

Well, I don't know about you guys, but I find the build quality to be horrible!!! First of all, I have several strange squeeks inside the car. Second, the passenger door doesnt align correctly and sticks out noticably at the bottom. Third, the drivers door requires you to literally slam it to close it (much different than the passenger door). 

What do you guys think? Do your GTOs have any non-drivetrain build quality issues??

(BTW, still love the car and I'd buy it again, the engine and trans more than makes up for the issues above)


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## mumrah (Apr 3, 2005)

you bought a lemon ... something must have been wrong with that car

Every GTO I looked at had perfict lines. All gaps were even spaced, a better build than most BMW's. I worke dfor a BMW dealership for many years.


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## GTOJon (Jan 25, 2005)

The ONLY issues of quality that I have on my GTO are the rattles of plastic on the dash board.

The two areas are:

1. Where the center console wraps up to the top of the dash; the flat black panel where some people have installed the oil and battery guages.

2. The second annoyance is either the vents that run along the windshield on the dash or the corners; OR the plastic that is in between the vents...seems to be the same plastic as the other problem listed above.

The rattles occur more often as the temperature gets colder outside, but is not totally gone at any time of the year.

Sometimes this makes me want to put my fist thru the console OR install those gauges which I figured would add more weight to it and hopefully absorb the vibration.

Has anyone had these problems? If so, what did you do if anything to fix them.


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## ohmy (Jan 16, 2007)

*Doors*

lemon?? hmmm, if those are the only issues its far from a lemon... 

But as far as the doors go, after noticing the doors on my GTO I checked out a few other GTOs on dealer lots, out of the 5 I looked at, 2 had slightly misalligned doors (like mine) and 1 had a gap so big I could have fit my pinky in it, so I suspect this might be a common "trait"....


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## kegbelly (Mar 23, 2006)

Other than a leaking front strut, mine has been problem-free. So far it's rattle-free too (knock on wood). No excessive gaps or alignment issues in the doors or body panels like you describe. Feels like a solid, tight, well-built car.


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## b_a_betterperson (Feb 16, 2005)

24K on my 2004 -- and it has been rock solid. And the panel fit is fantastic.


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## GTJimbO (Apr 28, 2006)

Bought mine last April and it's been a rock. Occasionally a very mild and indistinct -- I don't think I'd call it a "rattle", but lets say a noise. I think it's in the back seat or perhaps might be the driver's seat rail or something.

Dash is quiet -- even after I've taken it apart to install the Bluetooth and gaugepack.

Having owned Saabs for 25 years (and still do), and a VW and Audi or two, I'd have to say it's everybit as good in the build-quality/fit-finish department as the European makes. 

I have no complaints at all here. 

Sounds to me like some issues specific to your car. Did you buy it used or new?

Jim Miller
'06 M6 18", Phantom Black, JHP Gaugepack and Bluetooth
'02 Saab 9-5 Aero SportWagon, Lightly modified
'93 Saab 900 Turbo Commemorative Edition, Heavily Modified
'91 Saab 900 Turbo Special Edition Convertible, restored.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

*Same here as b_a. 

I couldn't be any happier. The quality on mine is fantastic.*


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

GTOJon said:


> The ONLY issues of quality that I have on my GTO are the rattles of plastic on the dash board.
> 
> The two areas are:
> 
> ...


Known issue – have the dealer remove the cowl and replace the vent screen. The screen, for whatever reason, gets sucked in, cracked, or just comes loose and it’s impossible to find unless you know the cause.


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## pickinfights (Oct 3, 2006)

ohmy said:


> lemon?? hmmm, if those are the only issues its far from a lemon...
> 
> But as far as the doors go, after noticing the doors on my GTO I checked out a few other GTOs on dealer lots, out of the 5 I looked at, 2 had slightly misalligned doors (like mine) and 1 had a gap so big I could have fit my pinky in it, so I suspect this might be a common "trait"....


If there is anything wrong with the 04-06 GTO interior... it IS a lemon. I have never seen a new GTO without an immaculate interior. And with propper care it stays immaculate.


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## patisi (Oct 23, 2004)

ohmy said:


> Before purchasing my GTO, I did my share of reading about it in various car magazines. There were various opinions about the exterior styling but just about every article I've read praised the GTO for being very well put together and having a solid build quality.
> 
> Well, I don't know about you guys, but I find the build quality to be horrible!!! First of all, I have several strange squeeks inside the car. Second, the passenger door doesnt align correctly and sticks out noticably at the bottom. Third, the drivers door requires you to literally slam it to close it (much different than the passenger door).
> 
> ...


Simple thing to do is to take the car back to the dealer and have someone drive the car with you and a new one on the lot if they still have one the lot.


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## CPO's GTO (Jul 1, 2006)

pickinfights said:


> If there is anything wrong with the 04-06 GTO interior... it IS a lemon. I have never seen a new GTO without an immaculate interior. And with propper care it stays immaculate.


:agree Mine is perfect inside and out! :willy: Except for a 1 inch 
scratch in the clear coat on the right rear quarter panel (garage mishap!)
  No problems with the build whatsoever...


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## GTOJon (Jan 25, 2005)

Mike_V said:


> Known issue – have the dealer remove the cowl and replace the vent screen. The screen, for whatever reason, gets sucked in, cracked, or just comes loose and it’s impossible to find unless you know the cause.


I probably didn't describe it well enough or I misunderstood you, but the piece(s) that I am talking about are interior...not the plastic under the windshield wipers. Unless the sound being produced seems to be on the inside but it's really what you are saying...

The one rattle that I know for sure is coming from the panel that the oil and battery gauge would sit on. When I place my hand on it, it stops. So that's certainly problem one.

I will look into what you mentioned about the exterior plastic piece.

Thanks for the help. Any other info is welcomed.


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## MeanGoat (Jan 4, 2006)

Anyone else have a bubble under the suede toward the front of each door in the curve?

Have it on both sides. Passenger side was so bad when new that it started separating and the dealer replaced it. even the new one had a small bubble.

Small grievance overall


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## ELP_JC (Jan 9, 2007)

Hey guys, let's get real. The GTO is nice, but as good as a BMW? I don't think so. Just open your trunk and compare the cheap and unfinished fabric held with giant fasteners to a nicely lined and carpeted Lexus or BMW. Or their triple-seal doors rather than a single one. 
You can see GM's cheap hand all over, but overall, it's much better than a domestic GM. And I do like the interior on the GTO better than the BMW, but it's not built better. But this car is all about the drivetrain (especially the motor), and if not abused, is pretty reliable. That's why most of us bought the car to begin with. 

My car had many defects: paint stains, many black spots on paint, doors are not aligned well (or on any other GTO I saw...and were many) and CANNOT be adjusted (hangers are welded), but I had my expectations low, so I'm a happy camper. I just hope it doesn't give me any problems, especially since I don't abuse it at all. 
I'm very happy with my car, but I'm not blind. And I have never been brand or model loyal, and never will be. Take care guys.
JC


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

GTOJon said:


> I probably didn't describe it well enough or I misunderstood you, but the piece(s) that I am talking about are interior...not the plastic under the windshield wipers. Unless the sound being produced seems to be on the inside but it's really what you are saying...
> 
> The one rattle that I know for sure is coming from the panel that the oil and battery gauge would sit on. When I place my hand on it, it stops. So that's certainly problem one.
> 
> ...


Exactly, but it's kind of hard to know exactly where it is, right? Sounds like the the upper vents or the pod area, maybe even near the radio (that's the symptom).

Next time you hear the noise, open and close the hood, listen for the noise, and do it once more if you still hear it.. If it goes away for a bit, the outside screen is your issue. If you don't get it fixed it will worse.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

ELP_JC said:


> Hey guys, let's get real. The GTO is nice, but as good as a BMW? I don't think so. Just open your trunk and compare the cheap and unfinished fabric held with giant fasteners to a nicely lined and carpeted Lexus or BMW. Or their triple-seal doors rather than a single one.
> You can see GM's cheap hand all over, but overall, it's much better than a domestic GM. And I do like the interior on the GTO better than the BMW, but it's not built better. But this car is all about the drivetrain (especially the motor), and if not abused, is pretty reliable. That's why most of us bought the car to begin with.
> 
> My car had many defects: paint stains, many black spots on paint, doors are not aligned well (or on any other GTO I saw...and were many) and CANNOT be adjusted (hangers are welded), but I had my expectations low, so I'm a happy camper. I just hope it doesn't give me any problems, especially since I don't abuse it at all.
> ...


*I paid 30K for my GTO....How much is the BMW?*


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## ohmy (Jan 16, 2007)

JC,

So glad you chimed in, I was beginning to think that I was crazy. I agree with everything you said in your post reply, especially about the doors. I was surprised as hell to hear that most people that replied have "perfect GTO inside and out"... 

Out of curiosity , I took a ride past a couple of Pontiac dealers (again) on the way home yesterday, looked at 3 GTOs total to inspect the doors. It was just like JC said and just like the previous time I did this (different cars though) - the doors are all misalligned, the left side alignment was different than the right side on all the cars, the lines look great when looking at the straight on, but if you look at it at an angle you can see that the doors are never flush with the body, sometimes sticking out a little, sometimes sticking out alot...

Anyway, thanks for all the feedback on this, I think the folks that think their GTOs are perfect or are as well built as BMWs are either very lucky in that they got an exceptional GTO or they're blind to the shabby build quality, either way it doesn't matter, we all agree that perfect or not, we love our goats...


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## bg2m8o (Jul 25, 2006)

ELP_JC said:


> Hey guys, let's get real. The GTO is nice, but as good as a BMW? I don't think so. Just open your trunk and compare the cheap and unfinished fabric held with giant fasteners to a nicely lined and carpeted Lexus or BMW. Or their triple-seal doors rather than a single one.
> You can see GM's cheap hand all over, but overall, it's much better than a domestic GM. And I do like the interior on the GTO better than the BMW, but it's not built better. But this car is all about the drivetrain (especially the motor), and if not abused, is pretty reliable. That's why most of us bought the car to begin with.
> 
> My car had many defects: paint stains, many black spots on paint, doors are not aligned well (or on any other GTO I saw...and were many) and CANNOT be adjusted (hangers are welded), but I had my expectations low, so I'm a happy camper. I just hope it doesn't give me any problems, especially since I don't abuse it at all.
> ...


Lets not confuse what quality is and what it isn't. In it's purest sense, it is merely conformance to specification. I like Druckers definition as well, that being that quality is defined by what the customer percieves as value and is willing to pay for. Nothing more. A BMW customer might think a lined trunk is of value, and it may be to him/her. For a GTO likely not.

Good Thread guys!


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## pickinfights (Oct 3, 2006)

ELP_JC said:


> Hey guys, let's get real. The GTO is nice, but as good as a BMW? I don't think so. Just open your trunk and compare the cheap and unfinished fabric held with giant fasteners to a nicely lined and carpeted Lexus or BMW. Or their triple-seal doors rather than a single one.
> You can see GM's cheap hand all over, but overall, it's much better than a domestic GM. And I do like the interior on the GTO better than the BMW, but it's not built better. But this car is all about the drivetrain (especially the motor), and if not abused, is pretty reliable. That's why most of us bought the car to begin with.
> 
> My car had many defects: paint stains, many black spots on paint, doors are not aligned well (or on any other GTO I saw...and were many) and CANNOT be adjusted (hangers are welded), but I had my expectations low, so I'm a happy camper. I just hope it doesn't give me any problems, especially since I don't abuse it at all.
> ...


I agree with Judge. I paid 24k for my 04 with 6k miles on it. And if you are going to compair luxury cars lets talk about some equivalent GM vehicals. XLR, CTS, STS, Have you sat in a loaded buick, Sabb. And they are still cheaper than most BMW and Lexus(Toyota).


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## tabes117 (Dec 14, 2006)

SO far no problems. To bad its sitting in garage under a cover.


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## NT91 (Aug 30, 2005)

MeanGoat said:


> Anyone else have a bubble under the suede toward the front of each door in the curve?
> 
> Have it on both sides. Passenger side was so bad when new that it started separating and the dealer replaced it. even the new one had a small bubble.
> 
> Small grievance overall


Mine is doing the same on both doors!!!!


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## Silver06 (Sep 19, 2007)

Hello everyone, new here, just a quick question to ohmy: what wheel and tire combination do you have on your car? It looks sick!


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## abright52 (Dec 17, 2006)

"Ohmy" last posted on 04-25-2007 at 09:46 PM. You may be able to try a PM, but I am fairly certain that the car in his avatar is not his anyhow.


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## BustersJudge (May 26, 2007)

My 06 has about 19000 on it had it for about 1 year only issue so far was door panel fabric (suede) was peeling on passenger door. Dealer replaced entire door panel under warranty no big deal. Other than that I have been very happy with the goat and I am very impressed at the level of quality compared to most domestics. Also as some others stated for the money the quality is very good. I worked for a detail shop for 7 years in that time I drove nearly every make and model and would say for the money I don't think you can get a better vehicle. Not too mention the driveline alone is worth the money and you won't get more hp/performance bang for your buck anywhere. That is my two cents.


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## Tacmedic (Feb 24, 2006)

*The only problem I have had...*

..is a buzzing in the shifter. Most likely a loose retaining clip. I can't decide whether to take it to the dealer or just go ahead and upgrade the shifter. The HVAC controls feel a bit cheap, but I paid $24,000.00 for mine with 9000 miles on it, so I hardly have room to complain.


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## macgto7004 (Jul 22, 2007)

Just gonna chime in here to say, besides my GTO(s) I have a BMW as a dd, so I have a side by side to compare to.
I have yet to find anything on my GTO that doesn't look, feel or work with the same quality of my BMW.
The fit/finish, the quality of the interior fittings are equal to my BMW. No squeaks, nor rattles to be found.
I only wish my GTO had a passenger side mirror, that tilted down when shifting into reverse, like the Bimmer. It is one of those little features that you really miss when you don't have it. Uh, that, and the heated seats!

Russ


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## Tacmedic (Feb 24, 2006)

macgto7004 said:


> Just gonna chime in here to say, besides my GTO(s)
> I only wish my GTO had a passenger side mirror, that tilted down when shifting into reverse, like the Bimmer. It is one of those little features that you really miss when you don't have it.
> 
> Russ


I hate that feature on my fathers BMW that I drive from time to time. I am used to driving an ambulance and almost never turn to look out the rear window while backing. Looking at the ground does not help me as I would rather see what is behind the car. 

I guess that is why they make so many different cars.


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## macgto7004 (Jul 22, 2007)

Tacmedic said:


> I hate that feature on my fathers BMW that I drive from time to time. I am used to driving an ambulance and almost never turn to look out the rear window while backing. Looking at the ground does not help me as I would rather see what is behind the car.
> 
> I guess that is why they make so many different cars.


I undestand it as a personal preference, I just happen to find it very useful. Helps to keep those rims looking nice!

BTW, my hat's off to you for being a first responder. You guys are real heros among us! :cheers 

Russ


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## 69bossnine (Aug 9, 2007)

I've got alot of cars, and I'm very impressed thusfar of how this GTO is put together... It's a nice piece, and very robust where it counts in the interior and door-frames.. It's also interesting, as so many aspects of the car are designed and executed in a manner that is so outside of the normal U.S. car norm... It's been a fascinating case-study... 

However, I am experiencing some steering-wheel shimmy, especially in the morning with cold tires. My brakes are perfect. So I suppose I've got to check front balance, allignment, and those struts...


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

*I periodically check the glue on weights on the inside of the wheels. I just don't trust them to stay on, however I have not seen any missing so far. *


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## macgto7004 (Jul 22, 2007)

69bossnine said:


> However, I am experiencing some steering-wheel shimmy, especially in the morning with cold tires. My brakes are perfect. So I suppose I've got to check front balance, allignment, and those struts...


Two words: Flat Spots! Almost guarantee it.

Russ


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## Wing_Nut (Mar 6, 2005)

I put 32,000 miles on my 05 before I abandoned it. Not many complaints. There were very few initial quality defects. I remember the DIC died early on. Of course, anyone with an 04/05 will bear witness to the clunky and slow seat mechanism. The sheet metal was well aligned and the interior was tight and rattle free right up to the day I sold it. The knobs stayed on the dash controls. Oh yeah, the sound system was a weak spot. It never gave me any trouble but it was just a subpar piece of audio gear for a 2005 car. I was Blau punked! And the OEM tires ( I had the 17's) were crap. Two sidewall blowouts at 140 +. The paint seemed to chip from road debris more than any other car I've owned. And once the paint was chipped, it quickly started to rust. I had a Volvo with 10 year old paint chips and zero rust.

But overall, I was very impressed with the quality for $34K.


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## Good 2 go (Sep 7, 2005)

I've owned roughly 8 different cars over the years, including a BMW 325i, Saab 900 Turbo, VW GTI and Mitsubishi Gallant. All of them made noises at one time or another. The Bimmer was by far the worse! Driving over uneven pavement had the doors rubbing against the rubber weather striping, especially in colder weather, as if the chassis was made of wet noodles. I would say my GTO is the most solid, noise and creak/squeak free of the group, if you don't count the GMM shifter.  My wife's B9 Tribeca is pretty solid too BTW.


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## Tacmedic (Feb 24, 2006)

Good 2 go said:


> I would say my GTO is the most solid, noise and creak/squeak free of the group, if you don't count the GMM shifter.  My wife's B9 Tribeca is pretty solid too BTW.


I am looking into an aftermarket shifter. Is your GMM giving you problems?


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## Good 2 go (Sep 7, 2005)

No problems, it just transmits the gear rattle noise through the shifter.


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## 69bossnine (Aug 9, 2007)

macgto7004 said:


> Two words: Flat Spots! Almost guarantee it.
> 
> Russ



Yeah, I'm very familiar with that tendency, as I have a large car collection, most of which sits dormant for extended periods of time... But I've gotten the shimmy in the middle of the day as well after the car's only been parked for a couple hours, which is a bit odd.. Makes me wonder if it's not over-night flat-spotting, but another situation that is simply more evident when the tires are cold... In any case, I'll figger her out..

My poor Carrera S hasn't moved for a couple months now, those Michelin Pilots are going to bounce like beach balls when I finally get it out... But I've let that car sit before, and the Michelins are good about re-gaining their roundness after a good high-speed-super-heat-the-tires drive

While we're on the subject of nit-picking odd tendencies, does anybody else here sense a slightly audible "whirring" from their a/c compressor as rpm's increase?? I've isolated it to the a/c compressor (because the noise isn't there when I turn off the a/c but leave the fan blowing, duhh....), but everything seems to be operating just fine...

Also, I think my rear end makes the ever-so-barely-noticable bit of noise/roar at lower speeds, but I don't think it's enough to panic over...

I've got my K&N cold air kit coming... I'm thinking next spring I'll be ready to go with a cam and headers...

A couple questions, 

1. How good is the factory exhaust from the cats-back?? I don't like "loud", so I'd prefer just to hold onto the factory mufflers and tailpipes as long as they're not a significant cork in the bottle...

2. When it comes to headers, is there a significant low-end-torque sacrifice with long-tubes on the LS2?? Are shorties the way to go for all-around driveability, or are the long-tubes definitely the no-brainer deal? In the small amount of web-surfing I've done, the Dynatech Supermaxx long-tubes and cat-pipes look like a decent setup...


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## bondosGTO (Sep 5, 2007)

69bossnine said:


> 2. When it comes to headers, is there a significant low-end-torque sacrifice with long-tubes on the LS2?? Are shorties the way to go for all-around driveability, or are the long-tubes definitely the no-brainer deal? In the small amount of web-surfing I've done, the Dynatech Supermaxx long-tubes and cat-pipes look like a decent setup...


every engine likes the long tube, from my experince. but getting them in can be a bear. i hear the GTO long tubes are a bit of a pain to get in, i think you have remove some steering parts. my advice get a set of long tubes, and manderal exhaust kit


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## 69bossnine (Aug 9, 2007)

I've got lifts and a shop full of tools, I'll get 'em in... Still wondering if the cat-back exhaust is worth the expense....

I know when I was modding my Lightning, that the exhaust kits gained just a sliver of horsepower, at the expense of sounding like a garbage truck... Not a wise upgrade...


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