# Engine build opinions wanted!



## jthoms (Apr 21, 2017)

Ok, to start off I've never had an engine built so I'm hoping the experienced can help. I've been researching a lot but this is a ton of money I am spending and these decisions are driving me crazy. I have a '67 gto I plan to put a 455 in. I have the block at the machine shop, it is a standard bore '74 block. Here is my plan so far for 500hp 500 torque, street driveable on 93 octane fuel.

Parts planned to be purchased from Butler.

Rotating assembly
Butler/Ross 468 .030 over 4.210 stroke (or should I go longer?), Eagle forged H beam rods. Eagle cast steal crank. Ross Flat top pistons -8cc, classic race file fit rings, Clevite performance bearings.

Top end
Butler/Edelbrock round port heads 87cc chamber, 2.11 1.66, Butler custom grind cam 288/294, duration .050 236/242, lift .521/.540, 112LS, performer rpm intake. 
PRW stainless 1.5 rockers.

Please help!


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

jthoms said:


> Ok, to start off I've never had an engine built so I'm hoping the experienced can help. I've been researching a lot but this is a ton of money I am spending and these decisions are driving me crazy. I have a '67 gto I plan to put a 455 in. I have the block at the machine shop, it is a standard bore '74 block. Here is my plan so far for 500hp 500 torque, street driveable on 93 octane fuel.
> 
> Parts planned to be purchased from Butler.
> 
> ...



So what is your question, just the crank? Go with what Butler suggests if they are building it for you. Butler knows how to build a Pontiac engine, so you are in good hands. Expensive, yes, but most Pontiac specific shops are expensive.

Each engine builder has their own suggestions, preferences, and opinions. 500HP & 500TQ is not too hard to achieve with a good 455 build. BUT, going to that level, you will also want to upgrade your driveline -transmission & rear axle, PLUS front disc brakes are a must.

The factory 10-bolt is probably your weakest link at this point, and then the transmission. You will want to add the upper & lower control arm supports so you don't tear up the rear frame. You may have traction issues or wheel-hop, so suspension upgrades may be needed.

So anticipate additional $$$ in driveline and suspension mods at the HP/TQ levels you are shooting for - unless you have already done this. :thumbsup:

If you are looking for specific itemized pieces for your build, throw a list at us and we can give you our suggestions/opinions and you can decide from there. We always like to help with an engine build, but know it is going to cost - throw any thoughts of a "budget" out the window. :yesnod:


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## bigD (Jul 21, 2016)

You can make that 500 torque number a good bit cheaper, if you don't insist on 500hp. 

400 hp/500 torque is quite common, with a 455 build. A good factory 455 crank is plenty good. But, if you don't have one, then the forged Chinese crank will work. I wouldn't go with a CAST Eagle crank. 

Don't need round port heads. If you want alum heads, the KRE or Edelbrock D-port heads will easily make 400-450 hp & more. 

Can even get by with less cam.

https://butlerperformance.com/i-293...cca-3315-3316-hr114.html?ref=category:1272239

Can make 500 torque with a HFT cam, unless you just want a roller cam. 

Here's a recipe for a lower budget iron head pump gas 455 that will make over 400hp & around 500 torque.

455 Long Block

Here's a 400 block stroker shortblock. A forged crank would add about $400 or so to the price.

455 Short Block

If you don't think your local machine shop can do the machine work correctly, Butler will do it for you, & ship the ready to assemble shortblock to you or whoever you want to assemble it for you. 

https://butlerperformance.com/i-244...4-cu-in-unassembled.html?ref=category:1234783


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## jthoms (Apr 21, 2017)

Thanks for the replies. I might reach out to Mr Williams and see what he can do. I'm sure my local machine shop does good work but he seems so busy he's not even getting back to my messages and he never answers his phone. I like the idea of having a guy build it that only does pontiacs. I am thinking of going with the iron heads Les suggests and changing things later if desired.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

jthoms said:


> Thanks for the replies. I might reach out to Mr Williams and see what he can do. I'm sure my local machine shop does good work but he seems so busy he's not even getting back to my messages and he never answers his phone. I like the idea of having a guy build it that only does pontiacs. I am thinking of going with the iron heads Les suggests and changing things later if desired.


Probably a better choice for an intro engine. Don't get hung up on HP figures. Look for TQ numbers as this is what moves the car. Cubic inches rule, so the 400CI with the 461 rotating assembly or 455CI is always a good choice.


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## cij911 (Oct 25, 2017)

Contact Williams....I have spoken to him numerous times - he answers his phone (and your questions), knows his stuff, produces very solid motors that last a long long time, and is reasonable.


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## dd68gto (Nov 14, 2012)

jthoms said:


> Thanks for the replies. I might reach out to Mr Williams and see what he can do. I'm sure my local machine shop does good work but he seems so busy he's not even getting back to my messages and he never answers his phone. I like the idea of having a guy build it that only does pontiacs. I am thinking of going with the iron heads Les suggests and changing things later if desired.


Please buy this book and spend a day or two reading. https://www.ebay.com/itm/HOW-TO-BUI...781125&hash=item2ac3fc2ec8:g:OLgAAOSwn2pcXeDx
You will feel much more confident on what you are doing and save yourself thousands of dollars in process . The book is out of press so it can cost you a little but well worth it . As you were told with minor upgrades using 6x iron heads to control c/r you can hit 500 lbs. I'm not a huge fan of these Pontiac motor builders unless you have a lot of money to burn . Please get a copy read it and you will be a happy owner. It also will give you the confidence and education on what to ask your builder . I'm a firm believer that many local shops can build a great Pontiac you just need to understand a fee quirks they have which most builder know . This book sells for 50 to 150 but ask on this site or PY if anyone has one they will sell. I I got mine for 30 dollars , it will be the best investment you make make on this build. Doug


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