# noise valve train after cam kit install?????



## brigos65 (Mar 28, 2013)

I just did a cam swap in my 06 GTO. New double roller timing gears, lifters, pushrods and, springs, cam .50 219 int. 227 ext lift 607 int. 614 ext @ 112 deg. RPM power band is 1500 to 6500 Comp part. #54-456-11. Well hears the shit storm I have and I could really use some advice!! I installed the cam straight up, reassembled the motor and started it up. I knew I was going to need the car tuned because the size of the lift. She’s running and…she has a very loud taping noise!!! Like not enough oil, a couple of lifters collapsed, or the stock rockers just can’t handle the cam????? I pulled the valve covers off to check if any push rods got bent… Nothing!! I got real good power even without the tune! My oil pressure is 40 to 45 psi. The car has never sounded like this until I installed the cam kit?? Any advice would be HUGELY APPRECIATED!!!!


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## AlaGreyGoat (Jul 6, 2006)

Are your pushrods the correct length for the base circle dia.
of the cam? Larger lift cams usually have a smaller base dia.
and require a longer pushrod.


Larry


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## brigos65 (Mar 28, 2013)

I bought a complete cam kit from comp cam. And what was strange is the push rods are the same length as the stock? Im calling comp today to talk to them about this cause I have to go back to the stock timing gears and Im pissed that they sold this kit to me and said it is compatable for my LS2.


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

It's always a good idea to check push rod length altho those may be the right ones. It's $20 for a push rod checker. Also check your rocker torque. The advertised power band of 1,500-6,500 sounds pretty optimistic. From the specs it's hard to tell everything about a cam. The lobe profiles affect power, noise and abuse on the valve train. Despite the large lift (which may or may not be really beneficial) the duration is on the very mild side. I would have opted for a more LS proven cam than that one. You are going to get more noise with any aftermarket cam regardless. LSx engines sound like sewing machines. Most "fix" the problem with a louder exhaust. 

P.S. How many miles on your lifters?


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

BTW just about every double chain is going to require a little bit of grinding on the cover to clearance properly


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

I'll say at the beginning I'm not an LS guy, but I do know "a thing or two" about engines  I don't mean to insult your intelligence or anything but you didn't mention much detail about how you installed everything, so I don't know what all you did in the process.
From what you're describing, lots of noise after a cam swap for _much higher lift,_ my first suspicion of what's happening would be that the bottoms of the valve spring retainers are hitting the tops of the valve guides, or you're driving the springs into coil bind.
Even though the springs came as part of the kit, you still have to check spring installed height before assembly. Very frequently, taller springs require the spring seats in the heads to be cut down some to provide more "room" for the springs to compress to accommodate the increase in lift. Frequently also, the tops of the valve guides need to be cut down some to make more room, otherwise the bottoms of the valve spring retainers will hit the tops of the guides (again due to the increase in lift).
If either of those things is happening, it also tends to bend pushrods and have other unpleasant results. I'd recommend not running the engine any more until you check all that out.

Good luck

Bear


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

Comp hopefully provided the kit that works with that cam. His lift is large but not huge. I'm at .612 x .600 and I've used it with different springs and heads. Many have used larger. I question his low duration and high lift on a stock head. He's leaving a lot of power on the table.


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## brigos65 (Mar 28, 2013)

Guys I appreciate your advice and inputs!! This forum rocks! Ok.. so here’s what happened after I tore back into the motor this morning! The double roller timing gears are not compatible with any LS motor! You have to use your stock timing gear because of the cam sensor! Witch Comp Cams was ignorant to tell me this!! Also so the cam was walking because of the timing gears too!!! I inspected the rockers and push rods again.. The rockers are worn and have play in them side to side. So I placed and order for some Holden scorpion 1.7 roller rocker. They are a direct fit for the LS motors. And I made an appointment with the machine shop to measure my push rods. But I put the motor back together and she starts like a champ again, and is running real strong. My appointment with the tuner is Tuesday and she should be running really well when there done. I chose this cam set up because the GTO is my daily driver! And let me tell ya!! LMAO….The traction control can’t keep this car down when you stab it at a 30 mph roll!!! But this was the best part after fixing all this stupid stuff!! I chewed up a CLK300 and a Vet on my test ride when I was driving around town. Once again I appreciate all the help from you guys!!


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## brigos65 (Mar 28, 2013)

svede1212 said:


> BTW just about every double chain is going to require a little bit of grinding on the cover to clearance properly


I didn't have to grind the timing cover and there was no signs of wear on the cover! ya just can't use double roller with out the timing mark on the cam gear!


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## AlaGreyGoat (Jul 6, 2006)

Comp Cams #7102 Double Roller Timing Chain Set GM Gen III LS2 (Early Model w/ 24 Tooth Reluctor Only)(1x Camshaft Timing Gear)
LS1-LS6 camshafts must have reluctor on the camshaft and LS2-LS3 camshafts don't need reluctor, it's on the timing gear


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

They make double chain sets that work for LS2 but there's really no reason for most people. The LS2 chain is a good one or a Katech C5-R for a better one.

Just about all but the biggest cams can be used for a DD, usually with lsa above 110. Not a lot of tuners can or will spend the time to fine tune the low RPM events and a lot of people think their cars run like poo because "that's just the way cammed cars drive". With my 228/232 111 lsa I can lug at 1,200 RPM in 6th gear without bucking. 

I hope you have good luck with the Scorpions. I've heard they "improved" them but just about every aluminum rocker I've seen has had a fair amount of breakage. Yella Terra, Harland Sharp, Scorpions, they've all had breakage issues.


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## brigos65 (Mar 28, 2013)

Are you serious??? Dude Im getting ready to install the new scorpion roller rocker this sunday! Wow.. I hope to god that isint the case?


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

brigos65 said:


> Are you serious??? Dude Im getting ready to install the new scorpion roller rocker this sunday! Wow.. I hope to god that isint the case?


Not every person has had problems and on the internet it can be hard trying to sort out if it was the use, cam, install or push rods that cause the trouble. I did say I heard they were improved. 

I just never saw the need for them unless you had TrickFlow heads or something that couldn't make proper geometry without them. There are some like Jesels that are awesome but they are out of the range or need of most people. 

The main selling point of aluminum unfortunately is taking advantage of the fact that steel weighs more than aluminum. . . _in the same volume_. What they don't say is steel is stronger and can take the repeated stress better so you don't need anywhere near as much mass. What matters the most is how far away from the fulcrum the weight is. Put a weight on your elbow and raise it. Take that same weight and try it with your hand. Look at your stockers and look at the aluminum ones. The stockers have a lower tip weight.


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