# Deal or no deal on a 1972 GTO?



## ROCKYMTNGOAT (May 20, 2010)

Hello newbie here from Colorado. I am looking at purchasing this 1972 GTO from a collector car dealer here in Colorado and was wondering if the price was fair or not. I've been pretty much a Chevy guy in the past with owning Camaros, Chevelles, Novas and such and am now looking for something different.I haven't had a muscle car for quite awhile now but since I am now in my 40's and have the money I am looking for my mid life crisis! Any help on if this car is a good buy or not would be appreciated.

1972 PONTIAC GTO, new built 400 (NOM), performer cam, gear drive, 4bbl Holley, lots of chrome, beautiful stock white int, rebuilt auto trans, Flowmasters, drives great & super fast, $15,500 (He won't budge on price)


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## ChromeCoach10 (Oct 26, 2008)

Do yourself a HUGE favor. There is a company that decodes the VIN # off of all GTO's to make sure that they are real. I'm not sure if I'm allowed to post their name or link on this forum (not sure if they are a sponsor/advertiser or whatever), so private-message me or e-mail me at [email protected] and I'll send you a link to them. It is well worth your time.

In 1972 the GTO became an option package on the LeMans, it was no longer it's own model, so there are a tremendous amount of clones out there that are less valuable. Providing that the body is solid on this car, $15,500 sounds fair. But do your homework on it first, otherwise you're going to get your mid-life crisis when you go to sell it...


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

If it's a real Colorado car and the body is as clean as it looks, that's a good price for that car. Check for Bondo everywhere, and make sure the floorpans and trunk are solid. Have it checked out by a pro. I like it, nice mid life chrisis car!


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

Get the Pontiac Historical Services packet on the car to verify it's a real GTO. For a couple bucks extra they will fax you the results.

Love that look with the forward hood scoops!!


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

+ 1 on the PHS. If its a GTO and checks out the price is not bad at all. For that price I am suspect... if it were local I'd be interested.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Sharp...... Here's a quick link to PHS.. PHS Historic Services


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

What all those guys said. If it is as clean as it looks, and checks out, it's a solid buy. You'd be hard pressed to do just a paint job and an interior refresh for 15k, these days. Let alone the rest of the car.The only thing that I personally don't like is the gear drive. Car is a knockout.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

geeteeohguy said:


> What all those guys said. If it is as clean as it looks, and checks out, it's a solid buy. You'd be hard pressed to do just a paint job and an interior refresh for 15k, these days. Let alone the rest of the car.*The only thing that I personally don't like is the gear drive.* Car is a knockout.


:agree I hate the sound of the gear drives, just sounds like metal flakes flying around, like something is grinding into something and you can just envision the tiny pieces of metal flowing through the oil! 


Granted, that's not what happens if set up right, but that's just what it sounds like to me.


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

I agree, Ruk. Gear drives are like sticking cards in the spokes of your bicycle. All about the bling, the sound, the "look at me" factor. Not about performance in a Pontiac engine...all the race guys seem to run chains. Less energy loss, and just as accurate. Plus, mechanical guys like yourself HATE it when an engine/tranny/anything mechanical SOUNDS like it's breaking down.


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## ROCKYMTNGOAT (May 20, 2010)

Thank you very much everyone for your replies! I am going to go get the vin# today and will run it through PHS for sure! The Guy who owns this shop is a one man operation and seems to be pretty reputable but then again you can never no that for sure.

As for the gear drive thank for that info. I am a factory Harley mechanic and after a few years after the new twin cam engine came out many people ran into problems with the Teflon cam chain tensioners wearing prematurely and as a result switched to gear drives to remedy the problem which worked well. I have never messed around with a gear drive on a car engine though. Your right though I have heard them when people run them. I used to call them the "poor mans blower". A way to get the whirling performance engine noise without spending the big bucks for a blower motor. Wouldn't be that hard to change back though I guess.

Email sent ChromeCoach10 on that info. I was not aware of anyone other than PHS for vin decoding but any extra info I can get on this car is worth it's weight in gold!


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## ROCKYMTNGOAT (May 20, 2010)

*Btw*

I am headed out to go get the vin off this car but had another question?
Can any info be obtained by posting the vin # on here for you guy to see or is posting a vin # online not a good idea?


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Sure, just don't post the last 6 digits. I'm guessing the vin looks something like this 2D37T2


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## Too Many Projects (Nov 15, 2008)

ROCKYMTNGOAT said:


> Thank you very much everyone for your replies! I am going to go get the vin# today and will run it through PHS for sure! The Guy who owns this shop is a one man operation and seems to be pretty reputable but then again you can never no that for sure.
> 
> As for the gear drive thank for that info. I am a factory Harley mechanic and after a few years after the new twin cam engine came out many people ran into problems with the Teflon cam chain tensioners wearing prematurely and as a result switched to gear drives to remedy the problem which worked well. I have never messed around with a gear drive on a car engine though. Your right though I have heard them when people run them. I used to call them the "poor mans blower". A way to get the whirling performance engine noise without spending the big bucks for a blower motor. Wouldn't be that hard to change back though I guess.
> 
> Email sent ChromeCoach10 on that info. I was not aware of anyone other than PHS for vin decoding but any extra info I can get on this car is worth it's weight in gold!


Too bad you're so dang far away. I have a 2000 TC 88 that needs the gear drive changeover with better cams...

Oh, yeah, I like everything about the car except the wheels. Hope I don't offend you but offer him 13k and he can keep the wheels....:willy: Welcome to mid-life. I have several crisis cars and a Harley now....


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## ROCKYMTNGOAT (May 20, 2010)

PON232172 (BDY)
24A (PNT)

Vin# 2D37M2P2xxxxx





Too Many Projects said:


> Too bad you're so dang far away. I have a 2000 TC 88 that needs the gear drive changeover with better cams...
> 
> Oh, yeah, I like everything about the car except the wheels. Hope I don't offend you but offer him 13k and he can keep the wheels....:willy: Welcome to mid-life. I have several crisis cars and a Harley now....


No offense at all it's his car and asking price. I did ask him about the wheels as I am not a big fan of them either they are to new for the car and just don't look right (Belong a a tuner rice burner more like :lol. He does have the original wheels and will give me either or but not both at that price. I think the most I could talk him down is maybe $500 on a cash deal.

Oh and be glad you have only cars and Harley crisis's as I have a third, Firearms. It always bums me out when I have to sell something out of my collection to go buy something else I want. Last fall I sold off my rare 5/66 HK41 for 2k less than appraised value to be able to buy my Roadking.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

I like the sound of a gear drive, and think they keep time better/longer than a chain. They also have quiet gear drives that don't whine as much. The noise is just oil getting smashed between the gears, drill holes in the gears to relieve pressure and the noise goes away.
He may need the bigger rims if it has upgraded brakes. Those rims have more value than the originals, I would take them, then trade them off or sell them then buy a set of Keystone Klassics for it, or some era correct rims. But, if the original rims are date coded and have good trim rings and caps, they are worth having.


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## Too Many Projects (Nov 15, 2008)

ROCKYMTNGOAT said:


> Last fall I sold off my rare 5/66 HK41 for 2k less than appraised value to be able to buy my Roadking.


18 months ago I sold an 88 IROC that I had 9k into for $3,300 so I could buy the 67 basket case GTO I am attempting to resurrect.....


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

Too Many Projects said:


> 18 months ago I sold an 88 IROC that I had 9k into for $3,300 so I could buy the 67 basket case GTO I am attempting to resurrect.....


That reminds me of my dad, he says he buys high and sells low.. 
I traded a 86 Corvette with fresh paint and a 91 5.0 Convertible for my rusty 67 GTO cloan with a worn out 389 and more bondo than metal. I'm right there with you. Seemed like a good idea at the time, hindsite is 20/20..


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## firecatsrt (Sep 15, 2008)

Beautiful car, I agree with ditching those wheels though. If I could only have my car finished for 15k... paint and body work alone are going to be 10k. Nice find.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

ROCKYMTNGOAT said:


> PON232172 (BDY)
> 24A (PNT)
> 
> *Vin# 2D37M2P2xxxxx*
> ...


Your vin looks good except for the "M". That letter denotes the engine size. Should be T(400), Y(455) or X(455HO).
2D37M2P2xxxxx
2 - Pontiac, D - LeMans, 37 - 2 door hardtop, M - ?, 2 - '72, P - Pontiac, MI(assembly plant)

As far as guns, I still own every one I ever bought, and some I inherited. Plan on keeping them all........


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

I bought my 70 Lemans rust free for $4K, rebuilt the supension, replaced the rear end, put a new motor in-350, and before paint I am at $9Kish. It will be $11K with paint. All I did to the interior is a $100 carpet. I did all the work myself and this is only a Lemans Sport. If the underside of the car looks as good as the top, that is a great deal. My mom does quilts, if she sold her quilts for $100 ea, she would make 25 cents an hour. $15K may pay for the parts in that car, all free labor. Unless the pics make it look way better than it actually is.


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## ROCKYMTNGOAT (May 20, 2010)

68greengoat said:


> Your vin looks good except for the "M". That letter denotes the engine size. Should be T(400), Y(455) or X(455HO).
> 2D37M2P2xxxxx
> 2 - Pontiac, D - LeMans, 37 - 2 door hardtop, M - ?, 2 - '72, P - Pontiac, MI(assembly plant)
> 
> As far as guns, I still own every one I ever bought, and some I inherited. Plan on keeping them all........


Thank you for the info on the vin# decode that helps me very much! As for the car I did go through it in much more detail today. The underside is nice but not quite as nice as the topside (No rust brand new exhaust just not Barrett Jackson clean). The only significant rust I could find besides minute surface rust was in the trunk and was a hole about the size of a dime. The Motor is great condition with some expensive billet pullys and low mileage being a new motor. Found a NOS bottle in the trunk EEK! was not hooked up and the guy told me was the reason for the previous owner having to put a new motor in it. Guess he burned up the old one lmao! Car is fast and runs great need new shocks for sure. The interior is original and has minor blemished like cracks in the door panel arms rests and shows minor wear and dirt which I would expect on white vinyl. Same with the top needs cleaning. Tach on hood does not work though was hooked up. Paint does have some minor blemishes chips and such no cracks on the endura bumper paint guess I would rate it as a 10 footer +. 

Now the worst part, I am 6' tall and 350+ lbs and as usual I don't fit in the damn car even with the tilt steering!!! I have short legs and am tall from the waist up but besides the fact that my belly dose not fit behind the wheel my head hits the roof and headliner unless I tilt it sideways so I was not even able to drive it. OK sure I thought about aftermarket seat or modifying the seat with a custom plate to move it father back but then it defeats my whole purpose of finding the most original muscle car in my price range so at this point am beginning to have second thoughts just due to the fact of not fitting in the car. On the flip side of that, if anyone else is interested in the car here is the link to the for sale ad so it's fair game to anyone! 90% of this guys (dealer) business is cars that are sold out of state or country so in anyone is interested :AutoTrader Classics - 1972 Pontiac GTO | Muscle & Pony Cars | Denver, CO


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

68greengoat said:


> Your vin looks good except for the "M". That letter denotes the engine size. Should be T(400), Y(455) or X(455HO).
> 2D37M2P2xxxxx
> 2 - Pontiac, D - LeMans, 37 - 2 door hardtop, M - ?, 2 - '72, P - Pontiac, MI(assembly plant)
> 
> As far as guns, I still own every one I ever bought, and some I inherited. Plan on keeping them all........


The M is not showing in my book. That engine code was not offered on the '72, this may be indicate its a LeMans.

As far as the wheels....They are easily changed. For my personal taste for that year I liked the honeycombed wheels.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Did a little more research. The "M" is a 350ci, 2-bbl V8, 160 hp. At least that's what the car was born with. It's a Leman's.........


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Driver doesn't fit the car, car needs honeycombs (I agree!), car is REALLY a Lemans. Several courses of action: Driver loses 100-150 lbs (no disrespect meant here..these cars were all built for "average" people...like school desks, furniture, etc); Driver buys car, which is now much less money due to its clone status, gets to keep his guns, and relocates the front seat/steering position; no matter what, Driver changes the rims to Honeycombs and throws out the Nitrous bottle. If you still like the car, and the idea of driving a nice ride that will hold it's value, it still may be viable.


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## Too Many Projects (Nov 15, 2008)

I think he needs a 66 Bonneville convertible....:cheers


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

I'll tell you what, There's something pretty attractive (to me) about the BIG Pontiacs of '59-'66. Especially the '60's-'62's and the '65-'66 421 2+2's. Talk about your full-sized rocket ships.....High quality builds, plenty of room, and plenty of power. 10mpg, here we come!! I read an article years ago where a mailman snagged a factory black/parchment 4 speed 421 '62GP for $175. (this was early '80's) The car was as slick as a mink and mean as a panther. I'd better stop there.....!!!


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## ChromeCoach10 (Oct 26, 2008)

geeteeohguy said:


> I read an article years ago where a mailman snagged a factory black/parchment 4 speed 421 '62GP for $175. (this was early '80's) The car was as slick as a mink and mean as a panther. I'd better stop there.....!!!


I worked with a guy who scored a 58 DeSoto for like $200 about 8 or 9 years ago at an auction. At around the same time, his friend from around the corner cleaned out some lady's garage (at her request) and she told him that there was some kind of car in there and that he could keep it as payment, she just had to find the title. Buried under a mass of sh*t he found a '67 GTO. It didn't run and it wasn't in the best of shape, but she came through with the title and it was his for nothing. I was in utter shock.

I haven't seen the guy since the year before I was married, which is 7 years this month, I'll have to ask my friend at work if he still has it and how he made out with it.


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