# It's only a LeMans



## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Hello,

I've been lurking the past few days after finding this site while trying to dig up some info on my car. I own the car pictured below an will likely begin working on it in the coming fall (I'm presently trying to finish up a '50 chevy pickup). My mother ordered this car from a local dealer in '64 and we've had it ever since. In '84 it was side swiped pretty badly (drivers side door and quarter) and then stuck in an old shed in hopes of someday finding a donor car. Of course 26 years later it needs a little more than just a new side now, but I did find a donor car. A GTO of all things.

Anyway, I plan on sticking around and asking questions here and there, but I had one major question. Is it ok that "It's only a LeMans" and doesn't have the quintessential *three little letters* attached to it?


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## FNG69 (Nov 15, 2009)

Just a LeMans is the same as saying just a GTO!! You do know the 64 & 65's GTO's were options on the LeMans. So Car is LeMans first GTO 2nd. The GTOAA even as a LeMans class at the National Conventions. Welcome to the forum and ask away!!!!!!!:cheersLes


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

+1 if there were no Tempest/Lemans there would be no GTO. and restoring it gives you a few more liberties to modify it without effecting the value drastically as in a numbers GTO. I Like that we are seening more lemans and Tempest restored instead of becoming parts cars, from what i can tell they seem to be the rarer car these days. A GTO in the original barn find condition my Tempest was in when i got it would have cost me 4 times as much. Out with the 326 in with the 462....lol, "Just a Tempest!!!!" Welcome to the forum, you will find lottsa help and encouragement here...:cheers

and they will know when they see you coming that it "just an old PONTIAC" and that alone should strike fear into them.

1966 Tempest pictures by instg8ter - Photobucket

Brian


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## Indecision (Oct 24, 2010)

A Z28 is still a Camaro, which is even more accurate in your years before the GTO became a model in opposed to an option as previously mentioned.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Well good. I figured an eyebrow or two would raise when I said I was going to cut up a GTO optioned car to save a LeMans.

Although, only three of you have replied. I'm sure there are still a few out there thinking "WHAT???". 

Thanks for the welcome.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

Post up some pics of both cars. Do you have a title for the GTO parts car? I love the Lemans, I am also a Lemans guy, so welcome! Where are you from to have a Lemans that clean, is the GTO as good body wise? My body guy could fix your quarter.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I'm in Southern Idaho. High desert country similar to Nevada, so it's very dry. There is zero rust on the LeMans, and the parts car consists of only a shell sitting on a blank frame, with no title.

The parts car frame has the rear end (which I am keeping but I still don't know the numbers for it yet) and power steering stuff and nothing else. I simply need the door post out off it and that's all.

Thankfully, I have a great body guy who has gone over both cars making sure I have everything I need to get started. Thanks though!


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

GhostTown said:


> Anyway, I plan on sticking around and asking questions here and there, but I had one major question. Is it ok that "It's only a LeMans" and doesn't have the quintessential *three little letters* attached to it?


Welcome! Yeah, sorry - no value at all in a Lemans. You need to get rid of it asap ---- soon as I get my trailer hooked up I'll be happy to help you with that, where exactly are you again? 

Seriously --- good luck. When you get ready to build a motor for it, give a holler on here to Mr. P-Body. The man knoweth much of that about which he speaketh.


Bear


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

My Tempest came outta Idaho near Boise, most of what i thought was rust on the frame was caked red dust from 35 years sitting in a carport, no rust on the body and pans am doing body now, so glad i dont have to deal with panel patches and replacement, ironing out the waves from a run away jack inside the trunk has been work enough for me. Buddy uses a two by six and L shaped threaded rod to pull out dents like that, coolest trick, welds them to the ridge line every few inches then cuts 2x6 wide enough to bridge to the good non dented panels at each side, drills for the rods then uses a nut and washer on every rod to pop the panel back have seen him repair some major cave ins that way. Necessity is the mother of invention. keep us posted


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I am just outside of Boise, 20 minutes West in Nampa.

My plans are to get it back on the road in full stock trim for now. It's a 2 barrel 326 with a 3 speed and power steering. No other important options. Montero red with parchment interior, as you can see. Once I get the body damage taken care of and restore the interior it should be good to go. There is nothing wrong with the engine other than it needing to be gone through and freshened back up.

Then, over time, I'm going to start collecting parts. I want a 400 (and would buy one at any time actually) in it, I'll likely use the factory 12 bolt rear end out of my donor car for it, and any other suspension goodies that grab my attention.

First things first though, finding out everything I need to get it back on the road, where to get it, and make sure I go about doing it right.

I'll put some other pics up later today.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

GhostTown said:


> Then, over time, I'm going to start collecting parts. I want a 400 (and would buy one at any time actually) in it.


Good choice  With just a little more green a 400 can become a 461. That's what I've built for my 69 "three letter" car. How does this dyno sheet grab ya?

Bear


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Dang, those are some nice numbers. Mind if I ask roughly how much extra green is involved?


Here are a couple more shots of the side that I'm not particularly proud of at the moment. I still need to find and buy a drivers side door.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

GhostTown said:


> Dang, those are some nice numbers. Mind if I ask roughly how much extra green is involved?


It's not as bad as you might think. 400 to 461 stroker kits are available from numerous sources. The rest of my combo consists of a mild to moderate solid roller cam, headers, and an 800 cfm Qjet on a factory intake. My heads are a little out of the norm because I was fortunate enough to find (and pay through the nose for) a set of real Ram Air IV's many years ago. Actually though, a good set of aftermarket aluminum heads would probably out-perform what I have. I just like the "cool" factor of the IV's.
When you get ready to get into it more, I recommend getting with Jim Lehart of Central Virginia Machine Services (Mr. P-Body on this forum). He knows how to help you meet your goals within whatever budget you have. I got my rotating assembly, valve train, and a bunch of other stuff through hiim. There are some videos of it running here.

Bear


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Cool, thanks for the info!


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## Indecision (Oct 24, 2010)

BearGFR said:


> Good choice  With just a little more green a 400 can become a 461. That's what I've built for my 69 "three letter" car. How does this dyno sheet grab ya?
> 
> Bear


I like everything but the redline. I am guessing that's an engine dyno?


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Indecision said:


> I like everything but the redline. I am guessing that's an engine dyno?


Yes, it was on an engine dyno. I'm quite happy with the "redline" myself. This motor makes all of it's torque squarely in the RPM range where it's going to spend the vast majority of its time - it's a pump gas street motor. If I'd been trying to build a race motor, it would have had a much "bigger" cam, more port flow in the heads, more compression, forged crank, and a single plane intake with a larger cfm carb. All of which would have been pretty much useless on the street.

Bear


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

How difficult is it to find a 400, and probably a bigger question, how do you go about shipping an engine if you don't find one within your part of the country? Is it even worth trying to ship one that you may have found on craigslist or something?


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

They're not hard to find. You should find a plethora of them in your local salvage yard. If you're going to build a stroker out of it the main thing you care about is the condition of the block, and perhaps the heads depending on the level of build you're planning. I don't know how expensive it is to ship engines, but you shouldn't have to resort to that just to acquire your base components. Another alternative would be to just buy one ready to go (crate motor) from any of the multiple vendors out there. If it were me and I was going to go that route, I'd ask Jim at CVMS to find me a good 400 "core" local to him and build me one of his "400 Pontiac Restoration" engines as a 461 and ship it to me.

He has customers overseas in the Netherlands who have had him build their engines and shipped them both ways - think about that for a bit.

Bear


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## Indecision (Oct 24, 2010)

BearGFR said:


> Yes, it was on an engine dyno. I'm quite happy with the "redline" myself. This motor makes all of it's torque squarely in the RPM range where it's going to spend the vast majority of its time - it's a pump gas street motor. If I'd been trying to build a race motor, it would have had a much "bigger" cam, more port flow in the heads, more compression, forged crank, and a single plane intake with a larger cfm carb. All of which would have been pretty much useless on the street.
> 
> Bear


I'm just used to my LS1, I shift at 6800 rpm.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Indecision said:


> I'm just used to my LS1, I shift at 6800 rpm.


Ah, well there you go. Pontiacs are vastly different from Chevys  While most Chevy guys (both BBC and SBC) worry signficantly (and with good reason) about how to get enough low end torque out of their engines to get a decent launch, we don't have that problem. Chevy guys usually have to resort to wicked low gearing and/or torque converters with stall speeds so high that they aren't really streetable to allow them to get up into the rpm range where they start making torque. On the other hand, Pontiac guys tend to struggle with how to get their cars to hook because all that bottom end tends to blow the tires clean off the car. Some resort to things like running single plane manifolds, not because they work better, but because they take some of the bottom end *out* of the car. 

Take my GTO for instance. I used Performance Trends Engine Analyzer program to model my engine, and what the motor actually ran on the dyno tracked VERY closely with what the program predicted, so I'm assuming at this point that their Drag Race simulator will be reasonably close as well. The car is not "done" yet so I don't know for sure, but given the torque/power curve and vehicle weight, Performance Trends Drag Race Analyzer simulation program is predicting mid to upper 11's on drag radials, mid to low 11's on slicks -- and that's with a very streetable 3.50 rear gear and 3200 rpm stall converter, shifting at about 5500 rpm.

Bear


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## Indecision (Oct 24, 2010)

BearGFR said:


> Ah, well there you go. Pontiacs are vastly different from Chevys  While most Chevy guys (both BBC and SBC) worry signficantly (and with good reason) about how to get enough low end torque out of their engines to get a decent launch, we don't have that problem. Chevy guys usually have to resort to wicked low gearing and/or torque converters with stall speeds so high that they aren't really streetable to allow them to get up into the rpm range where they start making torque. On the other hand, Pontiac guys tend to struggle with how to get their cars to hook because all that bottom end tends to blow the tires clean off the car. Some resort to things like running single plane manifolds, not because they work better, but because they take some of the bottom end *out* of the car.
> 
> Take my GTO for instance. I used Performance Trends Engine Analyzer program to model my engine, and what the motor actually ran on the dyno tracked VERY closely with what the program predicted, so I'm assuming at this point that their Drag Race simulator will be reasonably close as well. The car is not "done" yet so I don't know for sure, but given the torque/power curve and vehicle weight, Performance Trends Drag Race Analyzer simulation program is predicting mid to upper 11's on drag radials, mid to low 11's on slicks -- and that's with a very streetable 3.50 rear gear and 3200 rpm stall converter, shifting at about 5500 rpm.
> 
> Bear


I'm more of a row, row, row your boat type of guy. So an unstreatable stall is a non-issue. I have an RPM Stage V built T-56, RPS twin-disc clutch, so my car drives like a dream and I have a problem with blowing the tires off myself. But I have a lot of reasons that I can't hook other than torque. I have 4.10s, not much room for tire, and a coilover setup for road racing. I just drag race because I can, but that's not what the car is intended to do.

I may pull the trans and clutch for the GTO. We shall see.


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## russosborne (Dec 6, 2010)

Bear, trying not to hijack this thread(good deal for the op though, Lemans are good)(I have one) but what sort of mpg are you getting or expect to get with that combo?
Thanks,
Russ


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

GhostTown; there is NOTHING wrong with a '65 LeMans. Especially in a cool color combo like Montero Red/parchment. The fact that it's a family car makes it special, too. The others already said it: there are very few Lemans's and Tempests left these days....many have been cloned into "GTO"s. A LeMans is the same quality and trim level as the GTO, just a few minor differences (engine, suspension, hood scoop, etc.) Back in the mid 70's, a couple of years before I bought my first GTO, there was a local lady who drove around in a mint '65 LeMans convertible...Montero Red with a Parchment interior and a white top. It had a 4 speed, a console, rally gauges, and a rear antenna. I lusted over that car even then. You'll probably get more attention than the GTO's at events when its done due to the fact that you never see one!! Also, a 326 is not a bad engine. They are torquey, bulletproof, and can be made to run very well. With a small cam upgrade, headers, and a tripower, it can be a screamer. Good luck with your project.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

russosborne said:


> Bear, trying not to hijack this thread(good deal for the op though, Lemans are good)(I have one) but what sort of mpg are you getting or expect to get with that combo?
> Thanks,
> Russ


Truthfully? Don't know, don't care  This car is going to be for entertainment purposes only. For day to day mundane transportation I generally sneak out my bride's car  (I've got about a 45 minute each way daily commute to work, and since she "doesn't work" I get to take the vehicle that gets the best mileage. That's what she told me anyway...  )

Once I get the GTO going I might actually check the gas mileage.... once...


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

geeteeohguy said:


> GhostTown; there is NOTHING wrong with a '65 LeMans. Especially in a cool color combo like Montero Red/parchment. The fact that it's a family car makes it special, too. The others already said it: there are very few Lemans's and Tempests left these days....many have been cloned into "GTO"s. A LeMans is the same quality and trim level as the GTO, just a few minor differences (engine, suspension, hood scoop, etc.) Back in the mid 70's, a couple of years before I bought my first GTO, there was a local lady who drove around in a mint '65 LeMans convertible...Montero Red with a Parchment interior and a white top. It had a 4 speed, a console, rally gauges, and a rear antenna. I lusted over that car even then. You'll probably get more attention than the GTO's at events when its done due to the fact that you never see one!! Also, a 326 is not a bad engine. They are torquey, bulletproof, and can be made to run very well. With a small cam upgrade, headers, and a tripower, it can be a screamer. Good luck with your project.



Very meaningful encouragement, thank you. I like your suggestions on the 326 as well. My whole life I've wanted a car that was an extremely intimidating machine that could lift the front wheels, and growing up I've always thought it would be THIS car. But now as I get older, I'm not so sure that this is the right one to do it to. Simply sprucing up the engine a bit just might be the way to go. And, I am _definitely_ not a clone type of guy. They make my skin crawl for some reason (no offense to those who are into clones).

These are all great things to ponder before really getting started on the car. For now, I'm all about finishing up this dang truck. Hopefully it'll be on the road within the next few months.


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## JGEETO (Apr 26, 2011)

Well anyway, I want to wish you all the luck in the world on getting the parts and the $$$$ to finishing this wonderful project of yours. Once the LeMans is finished I'm sure like me, you will enjoy it for years to come. My advice to you is, make it the best 1965 Lemans it can be, and be proud!!

Big John


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

BearGFR said:


> Truthfully? Don't know, don't care
> Once I get the GTO going I might actually check the gas mileage.... once...


You will be happier just filling it up and not paying attention to mileage.. When you do the mileage of 8-10 MPG and $4 a gallon, 40 cents a mile babying it gets depressing, unless your getting 4 1/4 mile passes for the same 40 cents!!:cheers


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I heard this car run for the first time since 1984 yesterday.

After replacing the points, cleaning off the carb, cleaning the plugs, changing the oil, and a few other things, it started right up.


It's been quite a while since I've posted here. Just thought I'd tell some guys who really care about these cars that another one is being saved. I waited a long time for this.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

Nice!! :cheers


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

Good to hear your still on it....keep plugging away....got the Tempest done as you can see, they are all a work in progress


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Alright! :cheers I love it when that happens...

(You know you owe us photos and video, right? )

Bear


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## FNG69 (Nov 15, 2009)

GhostTown said:


> I heard this car run for the first time since 1984 yesterday.)


Feels good don't it..


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

It was a strange experience for me. Very difficult to explain. 

When something is introduced as being heroic and very special at a very young age you tend to make it even bigger than it is in your mind. Over time (my entire life) you keep adding layers and layers of complexity to that something. It becomes almost supernatural as a static object. I know this probably sounds strange.....

This car was so special to me growing up. I wanted it so bad. The problem was that it was broke. As a kid you think to yourself "How could something so special and neat not be worth the effort to try and get going again? It must be broke real bad..... Not even my super hero Dad can fix it!!" That thought sort of stuck to me. Through my twenties, and now late thirties. 

Recently my wife and I were discussing the car and decided "It's now or never" so we talked to my neighbor car builder guy and set up room in his schedule for it (I don't have the full knowledge, tools, or shop to build the car  ). All along I still carried this mythical thought of "It's really not going to happen. The car is broke badly. It's impossible to fix. She's not going to wake up".

Monday Stuart took the car while I was at work. When I got home he called and asked for my wife and I to come over so we could talk about some of the things he found. As I walked across the road I was explaining to my wife "It's ok, we don't have anything invested at this point..... whatever the problem is, we are no worse off than we were Sunday". I was ready for him to say the engine is toast, the frame is cracked, the rear end is dust.

When I walked into his shop he said "I wanted you to help me see if it will start" and directed me to the drivers seat and had my wife hold something silly to make it appear as if she were making a difference. He told me to turn the key, don't give it any gas or anything. Just turn the key.

The damn thing started up and purred smoothly.

My face turned white. It was as if someone had just told me at 3 years old that Santa Claus were not real. The damn car sat for close to 30 years, and he had it running in just a few hours of a day.

I'm still having a tough time getting over it. The human mind is a crazy thing.


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

now that you got her running start picking away at the stuff that will make it drivebale and safe and enjoy driving it again....these cars are way cool even with a little patina on them. Being in the high desert you dont have to worry about them rotting away underneath you like us guys in the rustbelt do, i will never buy another Michigan car, well worth 800 in shipping to import one from out by you. I have my uncle scouring the countryside for barn cars.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

We're picking up the donor car tomorrow. My car is heading out to a facility with a frame straightener on it so the body guy can try and pull out some of caved in floor before cutting it out. The frame is said to be straight and solid right now, but while he has it there he's going to take all of the measurements just to be sure. He says that it's good practice to try and straighten everything out as much as possible before cutting major sections out.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

:cheersCongrats!! Nothing is beyond repair.. Good luck on the build. Since you've never driven it, I'd go for function over form for the short term.. Awesome!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Dunno if I should start a build thread on this or not. I'll just keep posting stuff here for now.

The floor and door jam area has been pulled out and lined up straight before he cuts out the wrecked metal. A new quarter panel, and the rocker and jam from the GTO we cut up is going in this week.










The car is fully running on it's own now. All new fuel lines, gaskets, etc. have been put in. All new braking system (slotted discs up front, dual pot master cylinder, drum rebuild for rear) is sitting behind the car in this photo and is ready to go in.

Once all of this work is done then we are going to pause a few months before handing over the 8 grand or so to have all of the body work and paint completed. After that we'll likely wait a while again so we can recoup financially......... then attack the interior.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)




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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I really need to find a drivers door.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

:cheers Awesome thread. I'd do the build thread here, it's fine. YOu are real lucky you kept the car and not consider it too broke. Also great it was preserved and didn't rot into the ground next to the garage. Sounds like it's coming along great. I've found doors for these at the swap meets, try there. Good luck and congrats again.


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## 05GTO (Oct 6, 2004)

GhostTown said:


> I really need to find a drivers door.


Try Old Car City, they are showing 4 or 5 1965 Lemans' in their inventory. They are about 15 miles from me in White GA. If that doesn't work out PM me, I have a few other resources.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Since this is already well on its way on becoming a build thread, I just moved it from the member intro section to the resto section..... Good luck and keep us posted.....:cheers


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

68greengoat said:


> Since this is already well on its way on becoming a build thread, I just moved it from the member intro section to the resto section..... Good luck and keep us posted.....:cheers


Thanks again. I appreciate it.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

05GTO said:


> Try Old Car City, they are showing 4 or 5 1965 Lemans' in their inventory. They are about 15 miles from me in White GA. If that doesn't work out PM me, I have a few other resources.


I will email them. THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Old Car City shows this in their inventory:

1965 LEMANS 2 D SD (4)

1965 LEMANS CONVERTIBLE

1965 GTO CONVERTIBLE

1964 LEMANS 2D SD (2)

Two of them are post cars so they would be out. Am I correct in that a convertible door would work on a hard top?

BTW.... below is my current original red door.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Looks like they only sell whole cars and not parts.

"WE SELL RESTORABLE CARS. (WE DO NOT SELL PARTS)"


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Google "65 GTO DOOR" and see what comes up. Bob's Pontiac parts may have one. I have a friend who may have one, but he's back East for 10 days (going to Hershey). I will check with him if you haven't found one by then. I _think_ he got rid of all of his '65 stuff, but I could be wrong. Nice to see it coming along!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I've googled 65 Pontiac doors like you wouldn't believe. I think I might have the best luck learning about all of these Pontiac parts suppliers and calling them.

I sure do appreciate you guys giving names to call. Thank you much.


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## Logchain (Nov 29, 2011)

Looking good keep up the work. I noticed you were from southern Idaho. Im up north but spent my younger years down around Twin Falls. I know where a 64 4 door tempest is being sold/parted out up near Lewiston ID. Not sure if any parts would be compatible but its a thought.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Getting closer. This stuff is just resting in place for now.

Hope to find a door soon. Still need to make some calls.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

My mom and dad with the car in '65 - '66:


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

Was it already dented, or is that a crease in the pic?? Great pics, loving the project. Will be awesome to cruise with them in it.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

It was a crease in the old photo.

It'll be a very breezy ride with no drivers door.

WISH I COULD FIND ONE!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I found this door. $400 plus shipping which would be about $625 total. The door has a speaker whole cut into it. Opinions?


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## Logchain (Nov 29, 2011)

Called the guy with the 64 4 door that was being parted out. Someone has claimed the car but he put me onto another 64 2 door tempest. Helluva price for the whole car. Drivers door looks to be in solid condition. Its up in north Washington. Will a 64 door fit a 65???

64 Pontiac Tempest

The whole care is cheaper than the one door you are looking at.
Let me know what you think, I'm pretty busy untill football season ends but I might be able to have someone check it out.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Logchain said:


> Called the guy with the 64 4 door that was being parted out. Someone has claimed the car but he put me onto another 64 2 door tempest. Helluva price for the whole car. Drivers door looks to be in solid condition. Its up in north Washington. Will a 64 door fit a 65???
> 
> 64 Pontiac Tempest
> 
> ...


64 and 65 doors are interchangeable. Unfortunately though, that is a post car (sedan), and I have a hard top. Otherwise I'd be all over that. 

Thank you for looking for me!!!!!!


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## Logchain (Nov 29, 2011)

No problem, I actually told my old man about this car and I think he is gonna jump on it lol. I know a guy who has a 65 GTO with a 65 lemans parts car. I will try to get a hold of him and see if he has a drivers door or not and I will keep my eyes open if anything pops up.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

That's great. Thanks again.

Where abouts up North are you?


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## Logchain (Nov 29, 2011)

I currently live up in Moscow, but I grew up in Orofino. Spent my younger years down south of Twin Falls in a small town called Murtaugh.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Thanks for your help, Logchain. I ended up buying the door I posted above.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

That door looks fine. Hole in the door isn't a problem, you are putting an uncut door panel over it, right? Or, you can have door speakers, nothing wrong with that.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

GhostTown said:


> Thanks for your help, Logchain. I ended up buying the door I posted above.


Hey Ghost. Did you ever get a hold of Sorenson Bros? Just curious what they had to say....


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

68greengoat said:


> Hey Ghost. Did you ever get a hold of Sorenson Bros? Just curious what they had to say....


The email bounced on me, and no one ever answered the phone.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Thanx for the info. I guess I can get rid of their business card..... Sorry it turned out to be a dead end.....


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Hey, no problem. Again, I thank you for helping. I needed every lead I could get.

I contacted somewhere close to 20 different Pontiac yards, muscle car yards, private parts collectors, Pontiac enthusiasts, etc. and only came up with two physical real doors that I could see a picture of. I bet there are people out there with stock piles of doors laughing at me right now.

The worst part, there is a GTO down the road from me that has been t-boned so hard on the passenger side the car is hardly recognizable. Drivers side and door is perfect. The owner won't sell a single thing off the car, just lets it sit in the field. I think he enjoys the attention he gets from it, cuz he is a fowl son-of-bitch with an evil grin when he's approached about it.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)




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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I'm getting pretty excited. Once the door arrived we learned that a few more things had to be straightened out for everything to work right. The firewall was tweaked in the wreck too, apparently. Also learned of another accident the car was involved with in 1968.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I've decided to have some trim stuff removed in order to have a cleaner look. Almost a Tempest look with a LeMans grill.

We're removing the hood nose piece, the fake side louvers and 326 badges from the fenders, and the LeMans lettering on the quarter panel.

I'll leave the Pontiac lettering in the grill, and the LeMans badge on the trunk.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

This is the look I'm after. You might recognize this car from a magazine shoot. I took a few liberties here and turned it into what I'm hoping to achieve using photoshop. I'm not going with Torque Thrust wheels though, and this is also missing the Pontiac lettering in the grill.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

Coming along nicelly, so happy YOU brought it back from the dead!


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## FNG69 (Nov 15, 2009)

Know you are going to be happy with LOOK. I like it. I removed the Pontiac V from my hood & trunk lid on the 64 too. That little stuff is a pain to wax around!!!!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I sure appreciate the feed back and comments, fellas. Having outside opinions weigh in is invaluable. Especially from those with these cars.

Took this pic today. He's got it all welded in. It's time to start the finish work on this side, finally get the front brakes in, and then take it out on the road and drive it a little bit for the next few months. We're kind of wanting to give the car a bit of a shake down. See what we might want to change when we do the final paint tear down.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

Throw some etch primer over the bare metal, then spray bomb the side to stop any potential rust. Then get'er back on the road. Nice progress. Bondo absorbs water, so if it isn't sealed properly before driving, better to not do it now and do after the cruise.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

The inside of all the newly added parts have been sealed, and the seams have been sealed, and now he's going to do all of the finish work up to the primer and then seal that before we drive it. Including the front fender. We want to get this whole side prepped and ready for final paint.

We don't plan to drive it much. Just take it for some country cruises when the sun is shining in attempt to get a feel for how well the engine is performing, how it handles, and most importantly keep us excited about moving forward with the project.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)




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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Looking really good. I am all for "drive as you restore" personally. Much better than a pile of parts that sits in the corner of the garage for decades until hauled off for scrap!!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Drove it for the first time ever this evening.


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## jetstang (Nov 5, 2008)

CONGRATS, hopefully that is an after pic.. How'd it go?


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## Hot_Rod (Feb 10, 2011)

Very cool. I like the way it looks as crazy as that may sound! Lol. Reminds me of those "for sale" diecast cars you buy that looks like a project. Not many '65 Lemans around!


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

jetstang said:


> CONGRATS, hopefully that is an after pic.. How'd it go?


Yes, I took that pic right after driving it.

Honestly I didn't go far or even get it out of first gear. The guy who's been doing the work for me told me the day before that it would be ready to drive, but he was still working out some brake issues, and I didn't know how much fuel was in it since the gauge isn't working. I hadn't talked to him before driving it, so I didn't want to push it. 

Turns out, after talking to him later in the evening that he had the car out on the highway running hard between 70 and 80 mph making sure that everything was good before turning it back over to me. He said it smokes the tires in 1st and 2nd, and the new brakes stop it on a dime! I'm kind of happy about that. However, it still doesn't have the new shocks or springs on it yet so it's pretty bouncy and wobbly at speed. The front end needs to come up about an inch as well because the tires are rubbing at low speed turns. Might have something bent from the wreck under there as well, so it needs to be looked into.

I don't work through the week of xmas so next week I'm going to get it licensed and insured and then do a little testing of my own and see if I want to make any mechanical changes before we go through all of the final body work and interior.


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

your new springs will bring that front up...looking good :cheers congrats on the drive, thats the best way to keep motivated on these things and you can't drive'em when they are in pieces.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

How do I clean this thing up? It's the fuse block, and as you can see by the photo the contacts are very corroded which I'm hoping might be the reason behind some of the electrical issues I'm having. 

I removed the two screws that hold it to the firewall hoping that I could simply unplug the wires and then clean it up from my work bench, but it does not "simply unplug".

I realize that I need to replace this in the future, but I'm hoping to get it cleaned up and working temporarily so I can test other problems.

I don't even know how to get the glass fuses out without breaking them. :confused


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## 68GTO4004Spd (Jun 19, 2008)

Unhook the battery first. Spray it down with WD40 or PB Blast and let it sit for a couple hours then pry the fuses out. Don't worry to much about breaking them, they are fairly cheap to replace and you will need spares anyway. Use brake clean to get the rust breaker off and sand paper, emory cloth or small file to clean the metal prongs.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I didn't know if there is a special tool for removing them or not so I though I should ask. 

I was hoping to be able to pull the thing out, but sounds like I'll be doing the cleaning while bunched up under the dash, eh? If that's the way to do it, then that's the way.


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## 68GTO4004Spd (Jun 19, 2008)

There is a little plastic fuse puller (at least there used to be when all cars had fuses like that), but I have never used one. Just a small screw driver, I have used my car keys before, but not recommended, brass bends too easy. Nothing more fun then crawling under the dash and working in a cramped space, I hope you have the seats out of it.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

There are tools for removing fuses, I've got one. It's made out of plastic and on one end has a "downward" facing c-shaped opening that clips over the middle of the glass tube. It's about 1/4" wide. I don't remember where I got it, probably at one of the big box auto parts stores.
You don't absolutely have to have one of them to get the fuses out, it just makes it a little easier.

Bear


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Thanks for the responses. I think I'll head down to auto parts area of town and see if I can drum up a tool. It would be nice to have one in the glove box with some spare fuses.

Hehe.. the rear seats are out of it, but that isn't gonna do me much good here, however. S'ok though. I don't need it to be showy clean, I just want to get the contacts cleaned up enough to work.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I should probably get some sort of amp testing tool, like a fluke meter to help me troubleshoot.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

68GTO4004Spd said:


> There is a little plastic fuse puller (at least there used to be when all cars had fuses like that), but I have never used one. Just a small screw driver,


I use a very small screw driver too. Just pry up at the very end. Once one end is out, just grab it to pull out the other end.......

I always thought this might work good for cleaning. Dremel attachment:
225-01 Flex Shaft Attachment / Model: 225-01


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I went with the small screw driver method. Should have thought of that in the first place.

Interesting about that Dremel attachment. I have that very thing.

Auto parts store sold me some cleaner and I'll go at it later today.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

I've been doing a bit of cleaning. Steel wool over the paint to remove a majority of the oxidation and baked on dust from years of sitting, and then some rubbing compound over the paint and chrome. It kind of looks cool in a way. Old patina, but clean....

New shocks and springs go in tomorrow. I'm stoked about that.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

This is the other side (before cleaning). You can see that there is still a lot of body repair work to be done. The roof is a mess, too. But, I'm having a great time learning about the car as I do little mechanical fixes here and there myself.


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

in my opinion your doing it right ghost, not all of these cars need to torn down to the last nut and bolt, You get to drive the RatRod,while you plug away at it. so much more fun when you can get in and go for a ride after working on it...


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## gjones (Oct 8, 2012)

*fuse box*

I really love the looks of your '65-reminds me of a spy car! How'd you make out on that fuse box? Ours was 100 times worse than yours looked. (cleaned up real good). Were you able able to pull those metal retainers out of the box and scrub them up satisfactorily?


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

The fuse box turned out ok. I was able to pull the fuses just fine (screwdriver) and then I cleaned it with a wire brush on my dremel. Didn't fix any of my electrical issues though. It did prompt me to go around with an 12 volt tester and figure out that I had some bulbs missing or burnt out and that there was no flasher, so now all of my lights work. Tail lights are nice to have.

I may do some more testing this weekend to see why some other stuff isn't working.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

More cleaning. Might be silly and futile, but it sure makes me feel better about the car. The pictures really don't do it much justice, not that there is really any to be had. 

FedEx never arrived with the springs like they were supposed to. Hopefully they'll arrive tomorrow.


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## 67Gold (May 1, 2011)

This car looks great! This gives me hope for mine. Thanks for sharing the pics.


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## GhostTown (Jan 25, 2011)

Glad you like it. Good luck with yours!


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