# Remove Head from 67 400



## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

Ok
Background Engine has not been started or turned over for many years. Prior to this it was rebuilt and only a few milers put on it.
I was I dumb ass and did not take care of it by turning it over every once and a while again what a dumb ass.
I put mystery oil in the cylinders and let it soak for a long time repeated again and again.
Engine will turn when using a breaker bar on the crankshaft but will not complete full cycle.
It stops in the same place every time.
I am thinking I have a ridge in the cylinder walls.
So I want to pull the heads and see what I got going on.
Got intake, exhaust manifolds value covers valley pan and pushrods out.

Everything so far looks very clean and rust free.

All head bolts removed. Chain from front to back and lifting with cherry picker.
Tapping with hammer to see if I can get it to pop.

It will not budge. 

So anybody have a suggestion?


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

goat671 said:


> Ok
> Background Engine has not been started or turned over for many years. Prior to this it was rebuilt and only a few milers put on it.
> I was I dumb ass and did not take care of it by turning it over every once and a while again what a dumb ass.
> I put mystery oil in the cylinders and let it soak for a long time repeated again and again.
> ...



First, I would have used a bore scope inserted in each cylinder through the spark plug hole. You may feel even worse only to find out the cylinders are perfect and it was something else like a loose bolt on the flywheel hitting the block.

You should have also removed all the rocker arms to see if it was simply a stuck valve. If you could crank the engine over with the rockers loose, then you could zero in on which valve was the problem and go from there.

You might not be able to pull the head off "straight up" as the block has alignment dowels that stick into the heads. So you should be "pulling" at the same angle/degree the head sits on the block. Pull hard enough straight up on the heads and you may bust the head or block because those solid pin dowels are not going to bend.

Assume the engine is in the frame. Make sure all exhaust bolts are out - count them. Makes sure all head bolts are out - count them, believe 10 each side.

Thinking of another option, and I have never doe this my self so not sure if it will work, but find a piston that will come up near top of that bore, rotate to back down into the bore, insert a good length of rope that can be stuffed into that cylinder. Then rotate the engine to raise the piston up towards the top and compress the rope. As you turn the engine clockwise using the large balancer bolt, it might force the rope up against the head and pop the head off as you turn the engine/piston back and forth a few times against the head - leverage using the piston. Not sure if this will work, but I might try it.

Other than that, you may have to get rough with it.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

PontiacJim said:


> First, I would have used a bore scope inserted in each cylinder through the spark plug hole. You may feel even worse only to find out the cylinders are perfect and it was something else like a loose bolt on the flywheel hitting the block.
> 
> You should have also removed all the rocker arms to see if it was simply a stuck valve. If you could crank the engine over with the rockers loose, then you could zero in on which valve was the problem and go from there.
> 
> ...


Thanks Jim
The engine is on an engine stand. I did remove the pushrods and marked them to keep track of where they came from same with lifters.
I got them off using a screw driver between the block and the head had to get them to break loose from the gasket it was a metal gasket so I think it bonded with the head.
Well the issue was a mouse found its way into one of the cylinders. I forgot that the AIR pump had a opening that allowed the little shit a way in.
I will need to get some PB Blaster to see if I can bust it loose.

All the other cylinders look fine lifters and cam look good. So I need to decide what to do from here.

Thanks Again for the reply


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

You may need to have the one cylinder sleeved. I ran into this a few years back on a '64 GTO clone. The engine was a fresh rebuild, but done in 1979, and the car had sat inside a barn (supposedly). It was a correct tripower coded '64 389 with all the trimmings. I had a deal going but with the caveat that it had to turn over. I was assured it would. It did not. 
Then came the story...it had been stored outside from '79 to '84, when it was put in the barn. Pulling the heads showed water and mice had gotten into the engine. I did not buy it.
The guy who DID buy the car ended up doing 8 sleeves to save the block for a real car he had. $$$$$$. I just cranked my '65 over a few seconds the other day and pumped the brakes. Car has been sitting for 3 months!!! (or more)
Good luck.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

Looking at it closer after pulling the heads and cleaning out the seeds and such from one cylinder the reason it was not turning all the way around was due to the crank hitting the bracket on the engine stand.
Repositioned the bracket and all is fine. I think I dodged a bullet on this one. The wall looks good I flushed it out real good but will be doing more.

I am getting the body work done and I do not want to start a engine build at this time I am going to get a gasket kit and put it back together.
When I do the engine it will be a another pretty big expense.


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## Sick467 (Oct 29, 2019)

Glad you dodged the bullet. I had one of those with a rat's nest...turned out one cylinder was rotted through from the urine and such, but mine was a $50 short block that was a in-the-vehicle-field find with no heads on it. 

Do yourself a favor, oil the snot out of everything, maybe even grease the cylinder walls. I'd skip the spend on a gasket kit and just put it back together loosely, plug all the exterior holes with rags, loosely bag it, and store it in a nice dry, rodent free, area. I just did this with a short block since It will not be touched for longer than I dare guess, hopefully only a couple of years.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

I plan on putting back together and running it it was rebuilt before I parked it. Cam and lifters show no wear.
Not sure what else I should do before I put it back together.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

goat671 said:


> I plan on putting back together and running it it was rebuilt before I parked it. Cam and lifters show no wear.
> Not sure what else I should do before I put it back together.


Funny how something right in your face gets overlooked as you panic thinking it was a way bigger issue than something so simple. Happens to the best of us, and for me, it happens over, and over, and over......LOL

Would not hurt to put a little more cam lube on the cam/lifters while you have the intake off. Might save some grief since it has been sitting. Then I would prime the engine while on the stand with the valve overs off and watch for oil coming out all the rockers. Rotate the engine 1/4 turn, watch for oil, rotate 1/4 turn, watch for oil, 1/4 turn, watch for oil, and one more 1/4 turn watch for oil. This will ensure you get all/any air out of the system and you bearings are all lubed and ready to go - no dry bearings.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

PontiacJim said:


> Funny how something right in your face gets overlooked as you panic thinking it was a way bigger issue than something so simple. Happens to the best of us, and for me, it happens over, and over, and over......LOL
> 
> Would not hurt to put a little more cam lube on the cam/lifters while you have the intake off. Might save some grief since it has been sitting. Then I would prime the engine while on the stand with the valve overs off and watch for oil coming out all the rockers. Rotate the engine 1/4 turn, watch for oil, rotate 1/4 turn, watch for oil, 1/4 turn, watch for oil, and one more 1/4 turn watch for oil. This will ensure you get all/any air out of the system and you bearings are all lubed and ready to go - no dry bearings.


Yea that is a great idea on priming it. Regarding the bracket. It was your post reminding me to look for a bolt on the flywheel that got me looking. I am glad I pulled the heads as I needed to get the mouse home demolished before I started it back up.

Regarding the cam lube is it needed since the cam and lifters are already broken in? I do not have any sitting around I was thinking of coating everything with a lite layer of grease or would oil be sufficient?


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

goat671 said:


> Yea that is a great idea on priming it. Regarding the bracket. It was your post reminding me to look for a bolt on the flywheel that got me looking. I am glad I pulled the heads as I needed to get the mouse home demolished before I started it back up.
> 
> Regarding the cam lube is it needed since the cam and lifters are already broken in? I do not have any sitting around I was thinking of coating everything with a lite layer of grease or would oil be sufficient?


You did not say if you had a flat tappet or roller cam. If roller cam, the just a little oil as rollers are not an issue. But if flat tappet, since the engine has sat for a while and you said you only put a few miles on it, I would put some cam lube on just for the CYA factor of it. I can't see it hurting, but I would rather do that while the engine is apart and the cam lube will have that ZDDP in it for start-up protection. I suppose you could even put a light layer of STP additive on the lobes as it is supposed to have the ZDDP in it as well. Just personally, I would feel better with some kind of protection only because the engine is so fresh and not really run in for a long time.

Don't forget, when installing the intake to first tighten/torque up the long bolt at the timing cover that draws the intake into the rubber O-ring seal found between the timing cover and front of the intake. Then tighten/torque your intake bolts. This should eliminate any chances of a water leak at that O-ring.

Just my thinking, but your call.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

It is a stock cam and lifters. Would it be a good idea to chase the head bolt threads for that matter the intakes too? As far as how many miles I drove it for a summer put on maybe 1000 miles.
Thanks for the suggestions.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

goat671 said:


> It is a stock cam and lifters. Would it be a good idea to chase the head bolt threads for that matter the intakes too? As far as how many miles I drove it for a summer put on maybe 1000 miles.
> Thanks for the suggestions.


OK, flat tappet cam/lifters. Yes, I would apply some kind of heavier than oil lube just to make sure no scuffing or immediate wear when you go to fire it up because of how long it has sat and because it did not get a lot of break-in miles up to that point. Peace of mind versus having to tear down the engine due to a lobe or lifter going bad.

I would not bother unless you had some kind of issue. Nothing should have gotten into any of the bolt holes since the engine was bolted together, not even rat pee. But, you could rent a tread chaser kit from the local auto parts store and use the flat bottom chaser just because you can sleep better at night - just don't ever use a "tap" as they are for cutting threads and if you use that, you may damage the threads on the block. Maybe a little air, if you have air, and blow out the bolt holes and look down into each with a light for any junk.

The head bolts don't get any sealant as Pontiac blocks do not have the head bolts going into the water jacket as other blocks do. My machinist said to just put a couple drops of oil on the threads and then wipe off with a lint-free rag just to get a light layer of oil on the threads. The key here is to wipe dry the bolt threads/excess oil so only a film of oil is left. You *NEVER* want any liquid to get between the bottom of the bolt and the closed pocket it goes into - as the engine heats up, the liquid can expand, and like steam, build pressure and crack the bolt hole or block. I have always in the past just inserted the bolts as they came out and never even thought about any oil - they went in dry like they came out and I never had an issue. This is just stuff I learned by hanging around my machinist.


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## goat671 (Apr 13, 2019)

Thanks for the tips will follow your advice.


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Use regular or synthetic grease, or automatic trans assembly lube (basically dyed Vaseline). DO NOT use white lithium grease inside any engine or mechanism that needs to move in the future. It solidifies into plaster and will destroy your engine, trans, rear end, window regulator, or anything else you use it on with the exception of coating battery terminals to prevent corrosion.


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