# Is this a Judge?



## GTOJer (Oct 20, 2006)

A guy at work asked me if this was a Judge. It is sitting on a dealers lot. The on-line ad has the VIN listed. I know the 04-06 and the 67 but not the 70. I see it has no emblem on the dash but not sure if that rules it out. 

but I do know you guys will know.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

You can't tell by the VIN. The PHS document will identify it as one or not.
As far as the glove box emblem I saw no holes. The emblem had 3 stems that attached via clips inside the golvebox cover. Being there is no holes could indicate this is a clone without the 99.00 emblem or the glovebox lid was replaced and the emblem was not attached. Many clones I have seen the glovebox emblem is missing. 

The PHS document will tell the story.

Take a look at the engine... Look for the ram air. Are the hood scoops painted black? Judge in 70-71 they were painted black. I blew the picture up and did not see ram air decals on the hood scoops.


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## GTOJer (Oct 20, 2006)

I told him to contact HPS. Not my car, not interested in buying it so I am not spending the money. I was hoping someone could spot something.

There are more pics but they really dont show any more. Back seat, inside of door, etc.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

Just looking at the pics there are some inconsistencies but that doesn't necessarily mean it's not real. An engine bay pic would help. However the PHS is the ticket.

On a side note: CONGRATS on your chapter getting chartered GTOAA!


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## 05GTO (Oct 6, 2004)

One of the tell-tale indicators of a 70 Judge would be one larger heavy duty trunk lid torque rod on the left side of the trunk to handle the added weight of the spoiler.


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## Bobbyg (Jul 22, 2009)

I was under the impression that ac was deleted on the Judges.

Looks like a vent above the air controls in the pic.

Also, no emblem on the glove box door.

Where is the ram air knob?

PHS documentation is the only fool proof way to go.

I'm married, so I have been wrong before.


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## 67/04gto (Jan 15, 2005)

run the phs on the car to see if it is a real judge,also like above the torque rods in the trunk that hold the trunk is heaver for the wing.


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## GTOJer (Oct 20, 2006)

PHS - I KNOW, PHS - I KNOW, PHS - I KNOW.

If you read the beginning, not my car, it is on a dealers lot. Guy came to me because of my GTO connection and wanted to know if I could ID the car as being a real Judge. Not my area of expertise, I am the 04-06 guy plus I have had a 72 and 2 67s. Never a Judge. I was just hoping someone "might" see something from these pics that are from the online. Of course, my first comment to him was PHS.

For you guys who pointed stuff out, thanks, I have turned it over to the guy who asked.

and thanks on the Chapter congrats. Took me 3 years to accomplish that. Whooo-hoooo. Now we can start doing some shows.

Now, ask me some 04-06 questions.......


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

Has anyone mentioned PHS yet???!!! Seriously, he needs to get the documentation. I would have the guy tell the dealer he needs the vin to get he PHS doc. If the dealer says he can't do that, there's a very good chance it's not a judge. On the otherhand, if the dealer says go for it, there might be a good chance it is.........


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## GTOJer (Oct 20, 2006)

Here is the ad. Lists the VIN right in it. The guy who asked told me the price was somewhere around 14K.

1970 Pontiac GTO Green None. A Pontiac GTO at Suttle Motor Corporation Newport News VA

Now if there was just some Pontiac historical place we could send the VIN to. Hmmmm.


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

The Installed Options was kinda curious. Were they installed sometime after purchase? One would have to wonder. No mention of Ram Air. I would think if it had it, it would have been mentioned. Ram Air is a big deal..... Clone? I know I would be skeptical....

Installed Options:
Accent Stripes
Dual Exhaust
Rear Spoiler

Thanks for the additional info.....


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

It's NOT a Judge.

The price was a dead give away, so is the ad. 
I called to verify, for that money if it were real I'd be on my way to get it.

Sales guy did tell me its a matching number car. I'd still question that. Cloning out a matching number car will devalue it.


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## GTOJer (Oct 20, 2006)

You the man.....


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## 68greengoat (Sep 15, 2005)

GTOJer said:


> You the man.....


That's why he's the "Judge"....... Now I see the ad never called it a Judge....


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## even steven (Feb 27, 2009)

in response to the a/c option on judges,the only time a/c was not offered was if the car was a ram air 1v motor.that was for the judge and non-judge.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

GTO JUDGE said:


> Cloning out a matching number car will devalue it.


Why? 20 minutes with a hair drier and those stickers would be gone.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

Rukee said:


> Why? 20 minutes with a hair drier and those stickers would be gone.


True.


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