# Lifter Failure Issue Resolved



## STSGTO (Jun 13, 2006)

Over the last 90k i have put 4 sets of lifters in my 05 pontiac gto
I have been Running M1 5w30, The last lifters started failing after 1000 miles and started sticking real bad. Lost Horsepower and loud ticking sounds all the time.
Well before i rip the heads off i decided to test and try a new oils additives.
Long story short i fixed lifters and all my power came back after I changed to Castrol 5w50 high zinc classic car formula and I selected a longer paper oil filter and after the car ran for only 30 miles the engine noise was gone and car ran perfect. Any body else seen this?


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

Is you engine modified in any way?
Not to say this is your issue but......

Many are guilty of taking this car off the lot new and not adhering to the recommenced engine break in period. Taking it to the track from the offset, or beating the snot out of the motor before the motor can settle in CAN cause damage in the long run. It's also a reason for ring wear internal engine issues, excessive oil consumption and poorer MPG's than was advertised and what others are getting. When this happens people blame the car not themselves.

Getting a used GTO? Most have no clue on the history of it and how it was maintained, they end up with issues like you state and inherit a car with a motor that was abused or not properly maintained.

Not saying YOU did this or caused it... but the history of abuse on these motors from what I state from those on here stating their history of driving... this is the first thing that comes to mind when a motor like this fails.

That 50W is awfully thick for this motor and your cam should not need zinc. You may have issues in cold weather with that weight. You may get the same results using oil additives (STP or Lucas types) that thicken the oil. I am no engine expert but from experience back in the day, I used STP a lot in motors that used oil and had loud lifters and it helped.


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## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

Something else is going on here. Thousands have used M1 5w30 (and other oils like it) for years with no issue. Oil pump???


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

:agree Putting super thick oil into an engine to mask noises is an old "used car dealer" trick. It doesn't fix the problem, it just makes the noise go away - hopefully long enough to sell the car quickly because moving all that thick oil around puts a tremendous amount of stress on the oil pump and pump drive. If there's any weakness there, you'll know it soon.

If you've replaced lifters that many times that quickly, that tells me the real problem is somewhere else. 

Bear


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## STSGTO (Jun 13, 2006)

The motor spun a bearing at 80k and I had the motor rebuild all forged internals.
Before the spun bearing M1 5w30 had 3 sets of lifters replace by dealer.

Well the rebuild motor only has 12k with stage 3 heads and stage 2 cams
its has cran lifters long tubes and catback dyno tuned at 420 rwhp and 390 rwtq

lifters started failing again after 12k on new motor, horsepower dropped 40-50 hp

Tryed new oil all is well again, I had a ls1 trans am with mobile 1 10 years ago and I beat that car every day and never had a problem.


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## 05GTO (Oct 6, 2004)

STSGTO,
In your central Florida warm climate I would recommend at least a 5w50 synthetic or a 20w50 conventional oil, 5w30 is perfect for the colder northern states, when your running a 30 viscosity in 90-100 degree heat the oil will break down at around 200 degrees and cause the problems you are having.

JMHO


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## bbejj123 (Aug 6, 2011)

05GTO said:


> STSGTO,
> In your central Florida warm climate I would recommend at least a 5w50 synthetic or a 20w50 conventional oil, 5w30 is perfect for the colder northern states, when your running a 30 viscosity in 90-100 degree heat the oil will break down at around 200 degrees and cause the problems you are having.
> 
> JMHO


Not true, it really is dependent on what type of driving you do. If you are driving around town in traffic, its doubtful your oil temp would get absurdly hot. Running a thinner oil would actually help increase oil flow and help keep temperatures down. If you are racing it may be beneficial to have a more viscous oil, but then again even at racing temperatures thicker oil isnt all that much different than thinner oils on the market. Oil will not break down around 200 degrees as most oil tests are done with operating temperature at 212 degrees.


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## NucciGOAT (Dec 10, 2013)

bbejj123 said:


> Not true, it really is dependent on what type of driving you do. If you are driving around town in traffic, its doubtful your oil temp would get absurdly hot. Running a thinner oil would actually help increase oil flow and help keep temperatures down. If you are racing it may be beneficial to have a more viscous oil, but then again even at racing temperatures thicker oil isnt all that much different than thinner oils on the market. Oil will not break down around 200 degrees as most oil tests are done with operating temperature at 212 degrees.


Also to add a 20w starting viscosity is really hard on an LS motor at start up. The engine is the most vulnerable at start up when everything is relatively dry, you do not want your motor to have to suck up and move 20w oil through it when it is dry. 

I personally run a 0w-40 European blend for that matter exactly. As long as your operating viscosity is in check you want your starting viscosity to be a low as possible to lubricate and flow as quickly as possible on startup. The European blend castrol and Mobil is highly used by LS enthusiast and has shown very favorable UOA results. Google them and check it out. There is not much better for our motor. Studies have also shown that a 40w viscosity operates the best in LS motors.


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## bbejj123 (Aug 6, 2011)

NucciGOAT said:


> Also to add a 20w starting viscosity is really hard on an LS motor at start up. The engine is the most vulnerable at start up when everything is relatively dry, you do not want your motor to have to suck up and move 20w oil through it when it is dry.
> 
> I personally run a 0w-40 European blend for that matter exactly. As long as your operating viscosity is in check you want your starting viscosity to be a low as possible to lubricate and flow as quickly as possible on startup. The European blend castrol and Mobil is highly used by LS enthusiast and has shown very favorable UOA results. Google them and check it out. There is not much better for our motor. Studies have also shown that a 40w viscosity operates the best in LS motors.
> 
> ...


Yeah most of the wear happens to the motor before the oil is heated up to proper running temperature. Not to be confused with the temp gauge on the cluster. And each persons driving habits will be different so different oils should be used, not to mention if you use a different thermostat. For my driving habits, I'm looking to use a 0w-20 since I only drive 6 miles round trip and my oil rarely gets up to temperature so the thinnest I can get the better especially since it's winter.


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## bigdeezs (Jan 2, 2014)

I have read that many oil manufacturers are using less and less zinc in their oils. I'm not positive but I think it has to do with emissions compliance. I think it is still used more heavily in diesel engine oils like Rotella which alot of higher performance guys like to use but it is getting reduced in those as well. Pretty sure zinc levels of 800-1200 ppm is desirable and that many oil manufacturers are down to 300-600 ppm including mobil one. :/


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