# Wheel alignment Camber, Caster off



## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

I got new tires yesterday and decided to get a wheel alignment. I came to find out my camber was off badly. Looks to be on the right front side. Casters are off too. The manager at the shop said he can fix that with a camber kit. Price they want to charge me is $170 out the door. Can anyone tell me if this is a decent deal? It seemed a bit high to me. He also suggest changing my struts. I have no idea why but i think he wants to get some money out of me. I dont see what the struts go to do with this. On my wheel alignment receipt it says "recommend both sides camber bolts and front struts $400 parts and labor + tax reset alignment" 
But doesnt the results only show i need the right side camber kit not both?

This is what he suggested but i dont think i need struts or do i? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Heres a pic of the wheel alignment results below...

Im a lil concerned about my car and i know very little about this. I want good parts for my car. Does anyone know of a place near Los Angeles were i cant take my car? I stay in Torrance CA.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

No one have any advice?:confused


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## HP11 (Apr 11, 2009)

I haven't had any dealings with my front suspension as yet but I'd want a second opinion. I would think that you should be able to be set have the alignment parameters without using a 'kit'. If you have to use a kit, there's somthing else worn or damaged or the person that's working on it doesn't know what he's doing. Let me quote another member's answer from another thread. Though it's about rear suspension, it sums up my feelings about this very well.


Richtenb said:


> Seriously that is just bull. I do not live in USA but it is the same over here. A lot of the workshops just doesn´t have the skill to fix a nice 4 wheel alignment. They are just to lazy to calibrate everything. they just run their nice laser tool and then doesnt give a rats ass to pick up the wrench and do so some calibrating. So find yourself a nice workshop and they will be able to fix your camber. The workshop i do my alignment at could take up to 1 hour to fix it perfect. Good luck


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

Give Mike a call at Haddad Motorsports in Inglewood. I just had a custom alignment done by him yesterday. He would set it up for you according your driving style. He is a certified Pedders dealer and would recommend the correct fix for you. He is the only one near us that knows the GTO. Your radius rod bushings maybe bad thats why your caster is way off.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

GM4life said:


> Give Mike a call at Haddad Motorsports in Inglewood. I just had a custom alignment done by him yesterday. He would set it up for you according your driving style. He is a certified Pedders dealer and would recommend the correct fix for you. He is the only one near us that knows the GTO. Your radius rod bushings maybe bad thats why your caster is way off.


Thanks! I was looking for a performance shop but i didnt have any luck. Only one i found was West end Alignment in Gardena. Ill be sure to give Mike a call. How much was your custom Alignment and what did he do?


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

iwant2buyaGTO said:


> Thanks! I was looking for a performance shop but i didnt have any luck. Only one i found was West end Alignment in Gardena. Ill be sure to give Mike a call. How much was your custom Alignment and what did he do?


He charged me $150. He adjusted caster, camber, toe for the front and adjusted the rear toe. Anybody can do the alignment I think the dealership charged me around $60-$80. I drove two hours to get it done by Mike, he knows how to set up the GTO, so it was worth it to me.

FYI: there is no camber kit for the front of the GTO, two clevis bolts on the lower strut needs to be loosend and the set/adjustment screw adjust camber. There is rear camber kits that are not recommened because they are known to slip. Rear camber is not adjustable but toe is. Front caster is non adjustable but Lovells and Pedders sell caster adjustable radius rod bushings that will allow you to do so.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

GM4life said:


> He charged me $150. He adjusted caster, camber, toe for the front and adjusted the rear toe. Anybody can do the alignment I think the dealership charged me around $60-$80. I drove two hours to get it done by Mike, he knows how to set up the GTO, so it was worth it to me.
> 
> FYI: there is no camber kit for the front of the GTO, two clevis bolts on the lower strut needs to be loosend and the set/adjustment screw adjust camber. There is rear camber kits that are not recommened because they are known to slip. Rear camber is not adjustable but toe is. Front caster is non adjustable but Lovells and Pedders sell caster adjustable radius rod bushings that will allow you to do so.


Now i recall the shop manager saying i needed 2 camber bolts replaced and possibly my struts(monroe). This was my first stop. I had the alignment done there so i didnt want to just say ok put em on. I wanted to come home and do a lil research before i did. Hes was gonna charge me $170 for the bolt installation or $400 for everything including alignment but in the end i just told him let just do the alignment and i told him i would get back to him


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

You can order new bolts from Pedders and Lovells. I was told from Mike they are NOT TTY bolts. The service manual says they are and new bolts came with my struts. He says as long as they look good they are good to go. I replaced mine anyway because I had them.


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## AlaGreyGoat (Jul 6, 2006)

As GM said, the 2 bolts need to be loosened, and the top
of the tire pulled out to correct the camber of the right front
tire. The holes on the strut mount are slotted for adjustment.
On mine, the slot was just barely enough to get the correct camber.
If I needed any more, I was told they would need to extend the
slot a little.
Caster can be adjusted at the radius rod bushings with washers,
but its a pain to do so. I have Lovells and the are about the same to adjust
as the stock setup.(Remove the nut, pull rod out of bushing and move/add 
washer from front to rear or vice-versa) Don't know about Pedder's adjustment.

Take it somewhere else!

Larry


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

Much Appreciated!:cheers


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## motoristx (Apr 27, 2010)

GM4life said:


> Your radius rod bushings maybe bad thats why your caster is way off.



thats an understatement, the stock ones go bad very regularly. I'd look at replacing the radius rod bushings before you do anything. if they are bad, and you aline it, you'll still have "slack" due to the worn out bushing, and it will still eat up your tires. Its not cheap, but Pedders makes the best one I believe... also there is a rear radius rod bushing you can do at the same time, Pedders makes that too. by replacing these, you should almost completely prevent the tires "sweeping back" when you brake. thus cutting down on some of the inner tire wear in the front.

here at a local shop, close to Houston Tx, I got my bushings installed and a wheel alinement for about $150 labor. I also replaced an additional bushing i didn't mention that goes on the (lateral arm?) under the engine.


sorry was looking for a good link with price but i'm at work... lots of stuff won't come up here


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

GM4life said:


> You can order new bolts from Pedders and Lovells. I was told from Mike they are NOT TTY bolts. The service manual says they are and new bolts came with my struts. He says as long as they look good they are good to go. I replaced mine anyway because I had them.


I just spoke to Mike. I had no idea how weak and fragile the GTO's suspension was. Its a shame they havent done a recall on it. I told him what the problem was and he already new the problem. He advised me to get the Pedders GTO Street II package they offer. The cost is $1,940. A lil steep for me at the moment but he said that he can work with me. Instead of getting the whole package i can get some work done to my car to fix the problem. This package will def set you GTO to another level in suspension. Here is the link of what the package consists of...
Pedders GTO Street II - $1,940.51 - Haddad Motorsports


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## motoristx (Apr 27, 2010)

Those radius rod bushings should be #1 priority. when i did mine, that fixed almost everything, and i still have the stock crushed strut mounts.

after you get those done you have some breathing room, nothing else should be as loose as them. I'm not saying don't get the package, just saying if your on a buget this will get you back on track

i did front lower conrtol arm bushings and rear radius rod bushing at the same time. since they where under there

After this, no more pulling hard when braking, no more inner tire wear.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

motoristx said:


> Those radius rod bushings should be #1 priority. when i did mine, that fixed almost everything, and i still have the stock crushed strut mounts.
> 
> after you get those done you have some breathing room, nothing else should be as loose as them. I'm not saying don't get the package, just saying if your on a buget this will get you back on track
> 
> ...


i was thinking the same thing! Any other thing i should do as well that will help alot? Thank you for your advice. im gonna take it in thurs.


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## motoristx (Apr 27, 2010)

iwant2buyaGTO said:


> i was thinking the same thing! Any other thing i should do as well that will help alot? Thank you for your advice. im gonna take it in thurs.



pedders strut mounts will help your camber, if they are worn out. 9 times out of 10 they are crushed, and since it supports the top of your strut, if it moves any it will dircetly affect your camber. this is not a camber adjustment like first few posts in the this thread explain. this is just a good base to hold hold the top of your strut steady. unlike the other links, these come 1 each. you'll need to buy 2

if you decide to do this one, more then likely you'll need a new alinement done, or just do it all at the same time. I've not done my strut mounts yet.

also, they should give you a print out (if you ask) of the alinement specs before and after your alinement.





 notice the wheel moving back. thats what chews up inners of tires


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

motoristx said:


> pedders strut mounts will help your camber, if they are worn out. 9 times out of 10 they are crushed, and since it supports the top of your strut, if it moves any it will dircetly affect your camber. this is not a camber ajdustment like first few posts in the this thread explain. this is just a good base to hold hold the top of your strut steady. unlike the other links, these come 1 each. you'll need to buy 2
> 
> if you decide to do this one, more then likely you'll need a new alinement done, or just do it all at the same time. I've not done my strut mounts yet.


Sounds good. ill definitely keep that as an option. Thanks again.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

motoristx said:


> pedders strut mounts will help your camber, if they are worn out. 9 times out of 10 they are crushed, and since it supports the top of your strut, if it moves any it will dircetly affect your camber. this is not a camber adjustment like first few posts in the this thread explain. this is just a good base to hold hold the top of your strut steady. unlike the other links, these come 1 each. you'll need to buy 2
> 
> if you decide to do this one, more then likely you'll need a new alinement done, or just do it all at the same time. I've not done my strut mounts yet.
> 
> ...


Are you talking about when he comes to a stop?


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## motoristx (Apr 27, 2010)

yes, keep in mind he is going very slow to get it on film.

now imgine your going 45 mph, and start to slow down for a stop sign. every time you hit the brakes it will sweep back just a little. the harder you hit the brakes the worst it gets. when it sweeps back, it pulls the toe out just enough for your car to want to pull out at each tire (left itre slightly pulls left & right slightly pulls right). this does a few things depending on how bad it is, first it chews tires on the inside, since that is where most of the stress would be. 2nd, it may cause your car to pull left or right while braking.

this is a failed bushing from another company just linking it to show an exagerated pont of view. if this happened to us, the car would not be drivable at all


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

I took in my GTO today. i was advised to replace my radius rod caster bushings, heavy duty strut mounts and strut mount bearings. All of these parts would be from Pedders.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

**UPDATE**Just got pedders front radius rod caster and front struts with bearings put in today at Haddad Motorsports. My struts were definitely worn badly. As for my front radius rod casters, they didnt have a leak and they seemed to be still usable but i had them install new pedders casters! Everything seem to have went smooth until i noticed backing up while turning my wheel all the way to the left aftter leaving the shop. A loud grinding noise on the left front side. They put the car back on the rack and found out something(steering rod?) was rubbing against my wheel. Seems like my car did not like the new caster degree adjustments for sum reason. They were set at left (9.1) and right (9.3) positive. So they decided to lower the caster degree a bit. The new adjustments were left(8.6) and right (8.9). Took it off the rack and checked it and no more grinding! :willy: I cant say the car feels amazingly different but i can tell sum difference in my handling. Maybe its just because i have done a fraction of the suspension but i feel like my car is finally on the right track and i look forward to getting the rest of the suspension done by the end of the year. Haddad Motorsports did an awesome job installing and fixing this problem.


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

Glad you got taken care of. My car liked the 9deg caster settings I guess because of the aftermarket wheels and different tolerances of these cars.


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## Lukemo2 (Apr 13, 2010)

*Bushings*

I bought radius rod bushings, end link bushings, and sway bar bushings from pedders (front only) and installed them myself using instructions I found online. It took me a long time b/c I am new to working on cars...

I spent about 350$ on the parts and did it in 3 stages over a period of a week. With each new set of bushings I put in, I felt an improvement in some way with how the car drove. When I was done, I took the alignment specs from the pedders website and had the local midas do the alignment. 

When it was all said and done, there was a night and day difference between the stock set up and what I had done. The car just felt amazingly different in a good way. It's more planted, doesn't wander on the freeway, doesn't lean as much in turns, and rocks less when I hit the gas or brake. It was a dramatic improvement! 

The coolest thing about it was that I had done all the work on my own (except for the alignment) and had affected the car in a positive way. I was quite proud of myself in the end.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

Lukemo2 said:


> I bought radius rod bushings, end link bushings, and sway bar bushings from pedders (front only) and installed them myself using instructions I found online. It took me a long time b/c I am new to working on cars...
> 
> I spent about 350$ on the parts and did it in 3 stages over a period of a week. With each new set of bushings I put in, I felt an improvement in some way with how the car drove. When I was done, I took the alignment specs from the pedders website and had the local midas do the alignment.
> 
> ...


Nice! Im new working on cars too although i havent done much but put in my CAI and change some fluids here an there but i plan to soke up more info and possibly later start changing my brake pads. Im more of a detailer, lol.


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## Lukemo2 (Apr 13, 2010)

*yeah*

haha, me too.  

Another good thing is; doing all this suspension stuff will probably steer you away from the infamous "strut rub" problem GTO's have. If you haven't heard about it, just do a quick search on the forum and you'll find lots of information. 

It's a common problem.


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## iwant2buyaGTO (Dec 17, 2009)

Lukemo2 said:


> haha, me too.
> 
> Another good thing is; doing all this suspension stuff will probably steer you away from the infamous "strut rub" problem GTO's have. If you haven't heard about it, just do a quick search on the forum and you'll find lots of information.
> 
> It's a common problem.


Im glad i dont have that problem.


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