# Front suspension issue



## 2ocnorb (Oct 21, 2016)

I need some help and advice on my '65 front suspension. I replaced the stock control arms with tubular arms, both upper and lower. All suspension and steering parts are new. Replaced the stock spindles and drum brakes with new 2" drop spindles and aftermarket disc brakes. New coil springs, Moog #5256. Everything installed with the front clip off and the engine and tranny out. The problem I ran into is the springs appear to be putting a very heavy load on the control arms, so much that the polyurethane bumpers on the new upper control arms were crushed and exploded into pieces. I figured having the engine out caused this issue and would be remedied when the weight on the front end was re-applied. Wrong! With the engine, brake booster, core support and radiator back in, the control arms still did not move at all. I expected the control arms to raise up at least enough to replace the bumpers, however this did not happen. Am I missing something here, or is it normal for the upper control arms to always press on the upper control arm bumpers? I still do not have the transmission and rest of the front clip installed; fenders, hood, bumper, etc. Will these parts add enough weight to be able to raise the control arms to replace the bumpers? Doesn't seem like it to me, but this is my first time doing this, so I hope I am wrong. Help!


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## O52 (Jan 27, 2019)

Did you torque the upper and lower control arms mounting bolts?
Leave all mounting bolts loose until the car is fully assembled. This allows the arms to move as weight is being added.
Put tags on the loose hardware to remind yourself to tighten the bolts when the car is finished, and use rubber bumpers. The poly doesn't do anything except break when stressed.


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## Lemans guy (Oct 14, 2014)

Yes agree and use rubber bumpers as well...


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## 2ocnorb (Oct 21, 2016)

Ah, ok. I left the upper ones loose, but tightened the lowers. I’ll loosen them up and see what happens. Good advice on the rubber bumpers! Thanks,


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## 2ocnorb (Oct 21, 2016)

Well, loosening the lower control arm bolts/nuts didn't work. I even stood on the frame horn, bounced up and down and tried to use my weight to get the arms to move, but nothing. It feels like it's solid, with no movement at all. Not sure what else to do. Should I look for lower rated springs? I'd really hate to try to swap springs, since the were a pain to install... I did find a different Moog spring for 65 A-body, with a slightly lower spring rate. The current Moog 5256 spring rate is 315 lb/in with an installed load of 2174 lbs. The lower rate spring (Moog 5234) is 297 lb/in with an installed load of 2025 lbs. Not really much less. What else could it be? Could the springs somehow have jammed the control arms,, or possibly the shocks, in the position they are in now? Any other suggestions?


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## Lemans guy (Oct 14, 2014)

Are you doing this with the vehicle on the ground weight on the wheels? And the control arms won’t move?

if it is on jack stands you will never move the arms, the spring will hold them apart as you are describing.....so engine in and car on ground control arms will not raise is that correct?


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

The factory spring rate is listed as 275 lbs per inch with the optional V-8.


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## BLK69JUDGE (Jun 10, 2010)

are you trying to use the factory rubber rubber stopper ?
the aftermarket control arms use a flat 1/4" tall bummper stop and not the factory 1" tall ones
at least mine wouldnt fit with a factory one... with my tubular arms


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## LATECH (Jul 18, 2018)

Which control arms and spindles did you use?


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## 2ocnorb (Oct 21, 2016)

Lemans guy said:


> Are you doing this with the vehicle on the ground weight on the wheels? And the control arms won’t move?
> 
> if it is on jack stands you will never move the arms, the spring will hold them apart as you are describing.....so engine in and car on ground control arms will not raise is that correct?


Ok, I took it off all jack stands and lowered it down. The upper arms are still pegged, however, now when I push down hard on the front frame horn, the arms start to slightly move up ?. I’m hoping when I put the tranny, fenders, hood, and bumper on, it will be enough weight to compress the springs enough to replace the bumpers and bring it to the correct ride height.


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## Lemans guy (Oct 14, 2014)

Yes it needs to be loaded with all the factory weight, engine, fenders, hood bumpers, etc..........they are new strong springs and will stand it up strong...

are your shocks on? Because they also effect it, once on the ground the shock pushes up between the control arms with hydraulic force.

it does not actually “Absorb” the shock, the spring does that, it dampens the springs so it does not rebound and go .....boing boing boing.....a weak shock can effect ride height but only very slightly, when you put a new shock on you can see and feel the difference.

so all the components and new strong shocks may help....I like Bilstein shocks single chamber, or KYB single chamber......Bilstein makes them for the front,...KYB is a better price, check Summit...

let us know how you make out, good luck you will get it!


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## 2ocnorb (Oct 21, 2016)

I have KYB gas-a-just on the front and rear. Thanks for the advice and I’ll keep you posted on progress!!


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## ronayers1965 (Feb 14, 2019)

Sounds like you may have something more serious going on, such as an alignment issue or incorrect parts. I replaced the upper and lower control arms as well as springs on my 65 and had no problems. I did use factory-stock components. Check that the parts you received are correct for your car and that the springs are seated in the A-frames.


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