# New engine, or supercharger



## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Hey guys, I have a 2005 A4 with about 62k miles. right now it has 405 rwhp and 376 rwtq. It has lingenfelter intake, custom cams and tune by the vette doctors, straight pipes (with electric cutouts), jba shorties.. 

I really want to put a maggie in but i don't know if its worth it because of all the miles i already have.. So I want to know if it should be fine to just put in the maggie or if I'm better off getting a new engine (probably a better one like an ls7)?


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## Falco21 (May 11, 2010)

65k miles and your worried? These engines if maintained well, will last way past that. Possibly double those numbers. I would go with f/i. It would be a waste to replace the engine.


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Ok thanks. 
Just wanted to be sure, cause i know a lot of people have told me its better to supercharge it with low miles because it shortens the engines life. 
So now that that part of the questions done... I'm debating on which maggie i should get.. the tvs1900 or the 2300.. from what i've read the 2300 is for more worked engines.. I've been thinking the tvs1900 would be better for me and whats currently in the engine.. correct me if i'm wrong..


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## Poncho Dan (Jun 30, 2009)

1900 sounds right for a stockish motor.

I _was_ planning on doing an N/A stroked LS7 build, but now I'm wondering if I wouldn't profit more from 402/404 stroked & forged components being fed 12PSI through a TVS2300... my guess is that I'd be totally unstoppable, so, waiting on teh monies.:/ The whole reason why I wanted N/A was because every Joe Blow wants a supercharger on his ride, but seems like if you want to keep up with GT40's and the like, there's no other option, really. Just sick of hearing sh*t like "yeah my $75k Supersnake makes 850rwhp"...


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## Falco21 (May 11, 2010)

Personally, I would go with the TVS1900. There are a lot of fellow goat owners running that and with a cam/heads package, you will be putting down some serious power. Not to mention it seems to be a very reliable part. The 2300 will give you more, but it all depends how far you want to take this power wise. Don't go too far, unless your planning on spending some big money on the drivetrain.


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## Poncho Dan (Jun 30, 2009)

I wouldn't bother with 500+whp BTW without a mini-tub, which I plan on doing myself, since I have a nice MIG welder...


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## LS2 MN6 (Jul 14, 2010)

An LS Engine should last 300k Miles or more with proper care.

If you want more power, there are plenty of ways to do it without a new block or a supercharger. Unless you want a lot more power. Then you might want to start with an LS7 and build up. You don't even have to go dry sump (Hot Rod has an article about an LS7 to wet sump conversion for a 2010 Camaro swap)


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

What exactly would have to be done to the engine if i wanted to put in the 2300 (i'm still reading and learning about it)? I have about 10,000$ to put into the car... so with that said, what do you guys think i should do?


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

Poncho Dan said:


> 1900 sounds right for a stockish motor.
> 
> I _was_ planning on doing an N/A stroked LS7 build, but now I'm wondering if I wouldn't profit more from 402/404 stroked & forged components being fed 12PSI through a TVS2300... my guess is that I'd be totally unstoppable, so, waiting on teh monies.:/ The whole reason why I wanted N/A was because every Joe Blow wants a supercharger on his ride, but seems like if you want to keep up with GT40's and the like, there's no other option, really. Just sick of hearing sh*t like "yeah my $75k Supersnake makes 850rwhp"...


Come on now Dan. You know just as well as I do, if you want a NA engine to put out 800+rwhp you'd end up with a 500+ci engine where the short block alone cost more than strapping a S/C on a built LS2. Thats not counting the driveablity of the thing.


hockey499s said:


> What exactly would have to be done to the engine if i wanted to put in the 2300 (i'm still reading and learning about it)? I have about 10,000$ to put into the car... so with that said, what do you guys think i should do?


The 2300 requires a built bottom end. I've met the guys that work at Magnuson, and talked to them about the MP2300 and MP1900. The MP1900 will go along way with the proper matched parts. The 2300 would need forged lower compression pistons, forged rods and ARP bottom end. Thats to do it right and to get the full potential out of it. Someone may say yeah your fine on a stock motor its all in the tuning. Do you really want to cheat yourself?


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Well within that 10,000$ price range which do you guys think i'd be better off getting? Keeping it simple with the 1900? Or do I have enough to do the extra work for the 2300?


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

This is what I would do:
MP1900+tune
Drivetrain

My guestimate for a 2300 and built engine
MP2300: $8K
Pistons: $800+
Rods: $900+
Misc parts: $300+
Tune: $500+
Labor: $buttload


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Ok, thanks a lot. I'm gonna talk to a few shops by me and see what they can do. If its not much over 10k i'm probably gonna go with the 2300.


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

I am by far no expert just my opinion and what I have gathered by the engineers.

You can allways add a cam and pulley down a 1900 for more power and changing the heads too in the future. Its your money:cheers


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## Falco21 (May 11, 2010)

Personally if I had that money to put into it and was looking for f/i, I would go with everything GM4life noted. Doing the 2300 is your choice, but honestly I don't think it is worth it. I haven't looked lately, so not totally sure on the price difference if any. The 1900 should be perfectly fine for you and have plenty of power. Maybe you haven't been in a car with 600+ horses. Although it is bad ass, it makes you view life in a much more appreciative way  so to speak hahaha I just don't understand putting in that much money to make so much power you can't really use it anywhere on the street.


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## Poncho Dan (Jun 30, 2009)

GM4life said:


> Come on now Dan. You know just as well as I do, if you want a NA engine to put out 800+rwhp you'd end up with a 500+ci engine where the short block alone cost more than strapping a S/C on a built LS2. Thats not counting the driveablity of the thing.


:rofl: Yeah, plus a big ol' N/A motor like that is gonna cost big bucks to feed VS. a smaller motor with boost for the same power. In today's economy that's just not feasible. Unless you're a Wall Street banker, but then what would a rich man be doing with a "lowly" GTO?:willy: "Pontiac? Yeah I think my maid has one of those." :lol:


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Falco21 said:


> Personally if I had that money to put into it and was looking for f/i, I would go with everything GM4life noted. Doing the 2300 is your choice, but honestly I don't think it is worth it. I haven't looked lately, so not totally sure on the price difference if any. The 1900 should be perfectly fine for you and have plenty of power. Maybe you haven't been in a car with 600+ horses. Although it is bad ass, it makes you view life in a much more appreciative way  so to speak hahaha I just don't understand putting in that much money to make so much power you can't really use it anywhere on the street.


Well isn't the 2300 ultimately able to achieve more hp with work then the 1900 would be able to? Because i want to do whatever will give me more, and what i can do more to.


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## Poncho Dan (Jun 30, 2009)

It's able to produce more power because it's able to compress more air, being 400cc's bigger. In effect it can produce the same boost as the 1900 with fewer revolutions of the rotors.

Crazy to think I could put a blower on my GTO that has more displacement than the entire engine in my Grand Am. :lol:


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

Poncho Dan said:


> :rofl: Yeah, plus a big ol' N/A motor like that is gonna cost big bucks to feed VS. a smaller motor with boost for the same power. In today's economy that's just not feasible. Unless you're a Wall Street banker, but then what would a rich man be doing with a "lowly" GTO?:willy: "Pontiac? Yeah I think my maid has one of those." :lol:


:lol: I would be that rich guy that would do that. I would like to be a pain in the butt to other rich people that own high dollar cars:lol:


hockey499s said:


> Well isn't the 2300 ultimately able to achieve more hp with work then the 1900 would be able to? Because i want to do whatever will give me more, and what i can do more to.


Hey if you got it like that. I think the 2300 is about $300-$400 more then the 1900. Let us know the out come.


Poncho Dan said:


> It's able to produce more power because it's able to compress more air, being 400cc's bigger. In effect it can produce the same boost as the 1900 with fewer revolutions of the rotors.
> 
> Crazy to think I could put a blower on my GTO that has more displacement than the entire engine in my Grand Am. :lol:


Careful Dan. It can move more volume


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

GM4life said:


> This is what I would do:
> MP1900+tune
> Drivetrain
> 
> ...


When i got my cams done, i know they upgraded the rods.. Are those rods good enough for the s/c or do i still need them upgraded? (if it helps, in my receipt it says set of hardened push rods)..


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

By rods I ment connecting rods. Your pushrods are fine.


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Oh ok lol. I don't really know to much about the rods and pistons, so do you have any suggestions to which pistons and rods I should go with? I was also thinking about putting in some 1-7/8" x 3" kooks long tubes with 3" connection pipes with metallic cats. ( Kooks Long Tube Headers 1 7/8"x 3" - 2005-2006 LS2 GTO [K6703] - $1,035.44$931.89 : MarylandSpeed.com- Your First Stop on the Way to Performance! ) . Currently I have jba shorties.


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## GM4life (Mar 18, 2007)

From what I hear Mahle pistons are good inexpensive pistons. Why not 1 3/4" headers?


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

I Thought that the 1-7/8" work better with F/I? Should i go with the 1-3/4 instead? Also what type of rods do you suggest? I've been trying to search the forums, but im not really finding much into.

I found these just looking around on this site... Are there any specific ones i should go with for my car and what i'm doing to it?
rods: http://www.texas-speed.com/c-546-connecting-rods.aspx
pistons: http://www.texas-speed.com/c-552-pistons.aspx?pagesize=12&sortby=84&view=1&pagenum=2

I also found this site for pistons, but i really have no idea which pistons i need... http://www.lingenfelter.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?

If i go with the 1-3/4" long tubes then i'd probably get these.. http://marylandspeed.com/kooks-sign...to-limited-quantity-sale-k6700-kr-p-1124.html

(this is what i read about the headers though and why I said 1-7/8) "The 1 3/4" headers work great for most engines up to 450HP. Beyond that it is recommended you upgrade to a 1 7/8" header for increased exhaust flow"


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## hockey499s (Sep 22, 2009)

Ok so heres the update.. 
I went to the vette doctors today (in amityville long island) and got a quote made up...
Its gonna cost me about 14k for the whole thing.. the supercharger, rebuilding the motor, and the install and tune and the install for the headers. (buying the headers separately) 

Anyone know where i can get kooks long tubes for a good price? best i found so far is on maryland speed.. Kooks Long Tube Headers 1 7/8"x 3" - 2005-2006 LS2 GTO [K6703] - $1,035.44$931.89 : MarylandSpeed.com- Your First Stop on the Way to Performance!


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