# Turbo vs. Supercharger



## Gertythadirtygoat (Jun 1, 2007)

There seem to be many kits out there for boosting our goats. I need some feedback from people about what they think!:cool 

I know the supercharger will help down low and the turbo up high.... but i think i have it down between the Magnacharger supercharger kit and the STS turbo kit. Which one will be the best bang for buck? And im not wanting to go all out, just wanting around 550 whp. :rofl:


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## kgc (Sep 28, 2007)

*S/C or Turbo?*

I've had both - turbocharged on my vette and now a Magnacharger on my LS2. Love the low end torque of the SC. Had mine done at LPE and it drives effortless - where you need the power on the street, in the lower rpm areas. Also super easy to tune and plumb.


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## Gertythadirtygoat (Jun 1, 2007)

Which one feels faster to you? i mean even though to vette is a faster car. But how much hp you think the supercharger is putting down?


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## PDQ GTO (Jun 21, 2007)

kgc said:


> I've had both - turbocharged on my vette and now a Magnacharger on my LS2. Love the low end torque of the SC. Had mine done at LPE and it drives effortless - where you need the power on the street, in the lower rpm areas. Also super easy to tune and plumb.


kcg, Where do you take the GTO for Mods and tunes here in the Bay?

Thanks,
Rich


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## koman (Sep 25, 2006)

from what i have heard the sts turbo kit isn't too great quality wise. so i'd go maggie sc. look into aps or a local shop that will fab you up a turbo kit. turbo you don't have the constant whine as you would with a s/c and you'd probably put down the same amount of power with turbo as you would s/c but with less low end due to the spooling of the turbo. alot of that will depend on turbo size both turbine and housing sizes. :seeya:


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## Chrisco (Mar 19, 2007)

Gertythadirtygoat said:


> I know the supercharger will help down low and the turbo up high...



This statement is annoying. Everytime you hear turbo vs supercharger this is what they say. A S/C can get you more high end than a turbo. Centrifugals build boost rapidly the more RPM your motor is spinning. Roots will give you more boost down low. A twin screw would be the best way to go getting mostly mid range. A turbo can get you anything in between. Like koman said, its how you size your turbo. Big turbo means big spool up time means when it finally does spool up in the higher rpm's its crazy. Small turbo means quick spool up in lower rpm's and not as much peak HP. Here's a good writeup on turbos:

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/tech_center/turbo_tech101.html


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## hsv (Jun 11, 2007)

*Slp490*

Aside from the lower power/torque gain, how would you compare going with something like an SLP490 performance pac over turbo/sc. I'm guessing the hp/torque curve for the SLP490 would not be as flat as turbo/sc but then you are not paying any weight penalty so handling might be a bit better.

Speaking of weight penalty (for handling -- not for acceleration), how does a Maggie SC compare with an APS TT? Seems to me that that the TT with intercooler is going to add a lot of weight to the nose. Does this weight even matter from a handling point of view, or is it negligible?

HSV.


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## koman (Sep 25, 2006)

hsv said:


> Speaking of weight penalty (for handling -- not for acceleration), how does a Maggie SC compare with an APS TT? Seems to me that that the TT with intercooler is going to add a lot of weight to the nose. Does this weight even matter from a handling point of view, or is it negligible?
> 
> HSV.


 to keep weight off the nose look at a rear mount turbo. many of the weight issues will depend on your suspension set up. a properly weighted and sprung car will feel far better than a genericly sprung car. if you can get rid of body roll i don't see how the extra weight would hurt the car although i would also suggest looking into lightening when/where you can.


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## Gertythadirtygoat (Jun 1, 2007)

Well if what i said is to annoying for you please dont write anything in my posts anymore. Do us both a favor.

And with what i said the supercharger i was gona go with helps alot more down low and the sts kit doesnt even hit max boost until about 3800 rpms, so therefore that is high end. And those were the two i had picked between. 

Thanks everyone else for the input.


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## hsv (Jun 11, 2007)

koman said:


> to keep weight off the nose look at a rear mount turbo. many of the weight issues will depend on your suspension set up. a properly weighted and sprung car will feel far better than a genericly sprung car. if you can get rid of body roll i don't see how the extra weight would hurt the car although i would also suggest looking into lightening when/where you can.


Thanks Koman:

I've seen pictures of the rear-mounted STS turbos, that would be a great way to balance out the weight of the front. Do you know if the rear-mount turbos still need an inter-cooler? I feel like that is going to be the heaviest part of the system.

Ideally, I want to tighten up my suspension with a Pedders Street II/Serious Street kit. My ultimate goal is to have a goat that handles as well as it accelerates  

I hear what you are saying about body roll. As I understand it weight towards the front/back of the car is bad as it adds a lot to your "rotational inertia" and makes it harder for the car to rotate quickly about its center of gravity (without using throttle oversteer . The closer the weight is to your car's center of gravity the quicker it will pivot around this point. That's one of the reasons mid-engine cars have such great cornering capability.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Goat and would/will happily drive it stock for a while yet. But there's always the temptation to go that one step better 

HSV.


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## hsv (Jun 11, 2007)

Gertythadirtygoat said:


> Well if what i said is to annoying for you please dont write anything in my posts anymore. Do us both a favor.
> 
> And with what i said the supercharger i was gona go with helps alot more down low and the sts kit doesnt even hit max boost until about 3800 rpms, so therefore that is high end. And those were the two i had picked between.
> 
> Thanks everyone else for the input.


Hey Gert:

Thanks for starting a great thread! I never get tired of reading about FI options (or any other mods for that matter!).

I love all possibilities: SC, TT, SLP490. I think ultimately, it is going to come down to best power for handling performance. I would really like to see dyno's of a Maggie, APS TT and SLP490 GTO. I'll take a look around when I have some time to see if I can find them.

Does anyone know how to vary the point at which the FI kicks in? I think with SCs you can change the pullies so that the max boost comes in where you want it. With turbos it sounds like you have to size the turbo itself to achieve the same thing. Is that the case?

Any way you cut it, FI on a GTO is just *mean* 

Let us know how you go!

HSV.


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## silgoat05 (Jul 1, 2006)

i heard turbo's are better for the track more top end speed???


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## Gertythadirtygoat (Jun 1, 2007)

The turbo at the track makes sense. Higher end power means that the launches woulndt be as tricky.
Ive seen a lot of videos were turboed Ls engines kill supercharged Ls engines. I know that has to do with tuning and what boost they're at, but that could also mean that is is easier to get higher hp ratings out of the turbo... right?


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## Chrisco (Mar 19, 2007)

Gertythadirtygoat said:


> Well if what i said is to annoying for you please dont write anything in my posts anymore. Do us both a favor.
> 
> And with what i said the supercharger i was gona go with helps alot more down low and the sts kit doesnt even hit max boost until about 3800 rpms, so therefore that is high end. And those were the two i had picked between.
> 
> Thanks everyone else for the input.


I didn't say YOU were annoying man. Calm down. Also if you want top end and want to use a supercharger, you can always go with a procharger. They seem to make some good times at the track compared to the roots-style maggie.


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

silgoat05 said:


> i heard turbo's are better for the track more top end speed???


More top end speed doesn't necessarily translate into better ET. An 11.8 can be ran at 118mph or 120 mph. Therefore, in that case, a turbo isn't always best for the track.


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## hsv (Jun 11, 2007)

Gertythadirtygoat said:


> The turbo at the track makes sense. Higher end power means that the launches woulndt be as tricky.
> Ive seen a lot of videos were turboed Ls engines kill supercharged Ls engines. I know that has to do with tuning and what boost they're at, but that could also mean that is is easier to get higher hp ratings out of the turbo... right?


I believe turbos are more efficient than superchargers because they don't need to drive a belt/pulley system (loss due to rotating mass of pulleys and frictional loss of belts). I don't know the details though...


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## koman (Sep 25, 2006)

intercooler can be ran with rear/remote-mount turbos. there's other options to cool the air charges as well that would "shave" the weight. methyl injection or a small shot of nitrous might do it although i haven't heard much on that small shot of nitrous yet...try it, nothing to lose except a piston at worse... by small shot of nitrous i mean around 25 hp shot. just enough to cool the incoming air.


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## Chrisco (Mar 19, 2007)

koman said:


> intercooler can be ran with rear/remote-mount turbos. there's other options to cool the air charges as well that would "shave" the weight. methyl injection or a small shot of nitrous might do it although i haven't heard much on that small shot of nitrous yet...try it, nothing to lose except a piston at worse... by small shot of nitrous i mean around 25 hp shot. just enough to cool the incoming air.



I know some of the grand prix guys are using a 50 shot with some decent results. Grand Prix's have alot less compression than our goats though.


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## kgc (Sep 28, 2007)

To answer the questions posed to me. Sorry I'm late responding

I had a twin turbo Vette done by LPE. Yes, it was very fast but the technology in 1998 wasn't as advanced as today - especially in software.
The car had turbo lag but, being a V8 (instead of a 4 or 6 cyl) there was torque available anyway.

Then I had a head / cam / other stuff - Z06 that was done by Newtech Performance in Hayward, CA. Nick Newton is a GREAT guy and very talented.

My new '06 GTO is a Revenge / LPE car - the 530HP package. You can read about it at Lingenfelter's website. Even with 275's on the rear the car (auto trans) just melts the tires. Zip traction. It's a rocket. And with 500ftlbs you just tap the gas and away you go. I'm very happy with the say the engine performs. I'm not drag racing and I'm not tracking the car (although I will go to a track day soon just to see how it handles where I can go all out) - I'm 60 years old and just appreciate high performance cars that are unique. And the Revenge package is so good looking. I am asked by everyone "what is that?"

So - the Maggie is totally cool - sounds great - instant power, low and high up to the rev limit, and lives up to its OEM status / reputation.

That do it?


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## Gertythadirtygoat (Jun 1, 2007)

yup thanks buddy, that helped a lot!:lol:


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## kgc (Sep 28, 2007)

*Now what I'd REALLY like*

is a better auto trans shifter. The stock one is inept. A good ratchet type or, better yet, a paddle shift conversion. But, sadly, none on the market.

I'm fishing around to see if the 6 speed auto trans from the Vette is a reasonable option.

Problem is, there were so few GTO's sold that the car isn't a popular aftermarket target.


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## Tri-Power (Jan 10, 2008)

One of my good friends has an '05 with a procharger f1 unit. He currently is around 650 rwhp, with a similar torque number. I have been on many spirited rides in that car, and there is def. a BIG traction problem even w/ the KDWs. I am extremely impressed with the procharger it has big power the whole way through the rpm range. Plus you can't go wrong with procharger's exchange policy.


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