# Coilover suspension



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

I received a 1969 GTO after my brother passed from cancer. I am doing a full restoration and putting together a list of parts. I found an Alden American coil-over suspension and Wilwood disc brake kit for $3400.00 + S&H I am not a suspension guy but I want a nice ride with a low profile look. the kit comes with A arms and all of the brackets but not sure if I need all of this. I want to do a restore but my brother wanted to keep it original and I want to do some up-grades!! PRO's and CONs


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Unless you're going to be driving it daily, for distance, that's WAYYYYY overkill.

You can easily get tubular upper and lower arms, all the way around, with new new shocks and coils, and it'll be a MASSIVE improvement over stock, yet still relatively OEM.

That being said, the price you quote seems TOO cheap, but the link and picture is not viewable... so I cant say if its good or garbage.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

My car is a giant boat and it handles like a dream, with way less than that. 

I just did a controlled drift with my 67, on Sunday, and that's no easy task for a car that sits too high and is 30 feet long.


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

2jamesb2 said:


> I received a 1969 GTO after my brother passed from cancer. I am doing a full restoration and putting together a list of parts. I found an Alden American coil-over suspension and Wilwood disc brake kit for $3400.00 + S&H I am not a suspension guy but I want a nice ride with a low profile look. the kit comes with A arms and all of the brackets but not sure if I need all of this. I want to do a restore but my brother wanted to keep it original and I want to do some up-grades!! PRO's and CONs
> [/QUOT


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

Hope this is a better link


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

2jamesb2 said:


> Hope this is a better link


Doing research just a good rear drum, front disc brake conversation kits are running $1500. The coil over kits running about the same if not more If I go piecemeal with out the upper and lower control arms. I was wondering if this was overkill!! Let me know if this kit is trash the coil overs are Aladdin American with Wilwood Brakes


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

HIT THE BRAKES!

You have to be EXTRA CAUTIOUS when it comes to buying suspension parts.

VERY OFTEN the arms and parts themselves are "fine", but the hardware is extremely inferior. Its been happening a lot more lately. You don't want any "no name" parts. It's no good having a chromoly tubular a arm, if its going to connect with a chinese ball joint and pot metal bolt.

There's something suspicious about that setup.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

I found the kit you were referencing on ebay, and I don't like that I never heard of the coil-overs, or that they dont list the name of the arms.

Ive posted several threads about suspension in here, and you need to discriminate in this area! If youre doing 90 and engine or trans blows, you stop... but if your ball joints or tie rods go...

I've done extensive suspension replacements on these cars, and while Im not a fan of lowering, regardless of height, you can build a quality setup, for that same money.

Global West, which is the best of the best, 100% American made, Uppers and lowers, front and back... will run you around $2000. Add in 4 bilsteins, new coils, and front disc kit, and youll be right around that $3500, with free shipping from Summit.

A front disk kit is $400


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

My buddies on this forum who were looking to upgrade, but didnt want to spend Global West money, bought the no-name stuff, and then took my advice and threw away the hardware and replaced it with quality stuff.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Upper Front








Tubular Upper Control Arms with Del-A-Lum Bushings #CTA-42A (GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest 1964-1972)


<center><iframe width="375" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/7F23DVxZiDc?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe></center> Global West Suspension manufactures tubular upper control arms (with Del-a-lum bushings) for GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest--model years 1964...



www.globalwest.net


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Lower Front








Tubular Lower Control Arms with Del-A-Lum Bushings-For Coil Springs (GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest 1964-1972) #CTA-42L


<center><iframe width="375" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/3YXsTb9AFcA?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe></center> Tubular lower arms from Global West are supplied with ball joints, bump stops, Del-a-lum or polyurethane control arm bushings, special sway bar end...



www.globalwest.net


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Lower rear








Tubular Lower Control Arms with Del-A-Lum Bushings-For Coil Springs (GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest 1964-1972) #CTA-42L


<center><iframe width="375" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/3YXsTb9AFcA?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe></center> Tubular lower arms from Global West are supplied with ball joints, bump stops, Del-a-lum or polyurethane control arm bushings, special sway bar end...



www.globalwest.net


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Upper Rear








GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest Rear Upper Adjustable Tubular Control Arms Part #TBC-47 (1964-1967)


<center><iframe width="360" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/aDR5y4hsdik?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe></center> Global West Suspension manufactures Rear Upper Adjustable Tubular Control Arms for the GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, and Tempest---model years 1964, 1965...



www.globalwest.net


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Shocks








BILSTEIN SHOCK ABSORBER SET,FRONT & REAR SHOCKS,64-67 GM A-BODY,B6 HEAVY DUTY | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for BILSTEIN SHOCK ABSORBER SET,FRONT & REAR SHOCKS,64-67 GM A-BODY,B6 HEAVY DUTY at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.com


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Coils








Umi Performance Gm A-Body 1967-72 1 In Lowering Suspension Spring Kit P/N 4050 | eBay


Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Umi Performance Gm A-Body 1967-72 1 In Lowering Suspension Spring Kit P/N 4050 at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



www.ebay.com


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Brakes








1967 PONTIAC GTO Right Stuff Detailing AFXWK01C Right Stuff Detailing Front Disc Brake Conversion Kits | Summit Racing


Free Shipping - Right Stuff Detailing Front Disc Brake Conversion Kits with qualifying orders of $99. Shop Disc Brake Kits at Summit Racing.




www.summitracing.com


----------



## PDub (Sep 8, 2019)

armyadarkness said:


> Shocks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Would you recommend these over an adjustable shock? I'm considering replacing all 4 shocks but wasn't sure if I should go with an adjustable (like Viking or QA1) or go with the Bilstein. I read that the adjustable shocks can lower the height, which I'm not sure how they do it since a majority of the load is on the springs. Just curious if others have gone this route or stayed with the non-adjustable shocks.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

PDub said:


> Would you recommend these over an adjustable shock? I'm considering replacing all 4 shocks but wasn't sure if I should go with an adjustable (like Viking or QA1) or go with the Bilstein. I read that the adjustable shocks can lower the height, which I'm not sure how they do it since a majority of the load is on the springs. Just curious if others have gone this route or stayed with the non-adjustable shocks.


Ride height is always controlled by the spring... 

But yes, I would use Bilsteins at all four corners, over any coil-over or adjustable shock.

If you've ever compared your suspension to something modern, you'd quickly realize that there's just no point in trying to make it into an Indy Car. A new Hyundai ****** has a more advanced suspension than a C5 Corvette. The times have changed.

"Upgrading and Improving" is one thing, but you cant change what this car was... a family cruiser with a big engine. Will you feel an improvement if you go to a $5000 coil over setup? YES!!! But your time would be better spent polishing a turd.

That being said, my car sits very high and proud and it handles phenomenally. I can break the posi loose and control the car, confidently, and I whiz through turns! Bilsteins are the BOMB! Ride height is personal preference, though.


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

That is cool but my personal preference is the low profile look. My 1968 firebird sold it to purchase my C7 Vette in 2016


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Then by all means, go low-profile! Many do. There is a lot of flex in the chassis and suspension arms, which you can eliminate, and then really reap the benefits of low profile. Or, just do it for aesthetics.

The only time it matters is when cost is an issue. Cheap suspension parts are not good, and good ones are not cheap. four QA1 coil overs will cost almost $2000, just for shocks. I cant speak on Aldan... Summit sells them, but Summit has also started carrying a lot of inferior stuff, so that they can compete with ebay and Amazon.

Im not saying that it is inferior, just that I dont know, and you really need to critique anything that has to do with hardware (nuts, bolts, washers), ball joints, tie rods. Some budget kits are outright dangerous.


----------



## O52 (Jan 27, 2019)

This was my 70 ElCo. UMI suspension of tubular front upper arms with tall .5" ball joints, 1 1/4" front and 1" rear sway bars, adjustable rear upper control arms. Air Lift bags, reworked original steering box by LEE with 12: 5 ratio and 30# Torsion bar. 245/60 x 15 tires. Car handled extremely well. Moog springs brought it down about an inch in front and 1 1/2 inches in the rear.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Man that looks sweet, Ed!!!!


----------



## GtoFM (Mar 23, 2018)

RE: Rear coil-overs. I've read because these cars were not designed to carry the weight of the car on the top shock mount, it could crack the metal. Some kits include a reinforcement plate, but is it enough? I installed Hijackers back in the day and ran them fully extended of course. Yes, the upper mounting metal is cracked on left side. That'll be a fun repair!


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

It's not and they do. Ive repaired a few. No worse job than overhead welding.


----------



## ylwgto (Oct 27, 2009)

armyadarkness said:


> My car is a giant boat and it handles like a dream, with way less than that.
> 
> I just did a controlled drift with my 67, on Sunday, and that's no easy task for a car that sits too high and is 30 feet long.


Need video army!!


----------



## Noangelbuddy (Dec 6, 2017)

armyadarkness said:


> Upper Front
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I can understand companies marketing tubular making claims to get customers to fork over the money. Have no personal experience with tubular, but I am not a believer of their claims except for appearance. They do look cool … 😎, but I’m happy with my OEM control arms. American steel, made in America and have lasted for 57 years and will no doubt outlast me.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

ylwgto said:


> Need video army!!


I'm working on it. Tomorrow the new exhaust gets welded and then I'm done working on the car until the next thing breaks. I am glad you chimed in though you're in the best position to give him advice on a modern suspension with a low profile.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Noangelbuddy said:


> I can understand companies marketing tubular making claims to get customers to fork over the money. Have no personal experience with tubular, but I am not a believer of their claims except for appearance. They do look cool … 😎, but I’m happy with my OEM control arms. American steel, made in America and have lasted for 57 years and will no doubt outlast me.


Well my global West arms were definitely designed and built in America out of American steel, by a guy named Doug who owns the company, and his personal car is a 64 GTO. 

He has been racing GTOs on a road course for more than 40 years, and he's a huge contributor to the GTO community. 

I can only speak from experience that my car handles unbelievably, and it's sit's quite high, which is usually counterintuitive toward handling. 

I have been doing control arm bushing swaps on a bodies and Corvettes for three decades and they flex like crazy. When you press the old bushings out and the new bushings in on your workbench, it's like handling a spring!

I'm certainly not claiming that cars with factory control arms cannot be made to handle very well. I can only say that comparing the cars before and after is like night and day.

I also drive like unholy hell, and everything on my car gets exploited. If the sun is in the sky I'm driving it, and I'm pitching it sideways every chance I get. 

Most people with 67 GTOs probably never bother trying to make it handle well.

Ask anyone who has ever installed Bilstein shocks in their car if they noticed a difference and they will tell you that they will never use another shock ever again, so if a simple shock change can make a noticeable difference, imagine what frame stiffeners, oversized sway bars, load bearing surfaces, and improved geometry can do. 

I think that this is definitely a personal preference topic. Everybody has their own driving style for sure. I just think there's a damn good reason why you never see a Nascar or an Indy car with stamped steel control arms.

Even Pontiac realized that the convertibles and manual transmission cars needed boxed frames and frame supports.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

Noangelbuddy said:


> I can understand companies marketing tubular making claims to get customers to fork over the money. Have no personal experience with tubular, but I am not a believer of their claims except for appearance. They do look cool … 😎, but I’m happy with my OEM control arms. American steel, made in America and have lasted for 57 years and will no doubt outlast me.


By the way, to your point, I would definitely say that many of the tubular control arm companies out there are exactly what you state, cheap Chinese crap trying to get people to drink the Kool-Aid. However if you're talking about stuff from qa1, global West, Hotchkiss, or Umi, then these guys have spent tens of thousands of dollars on research and design... And of course now the Chinese are copying it, but they're hardware is straight up scary and I am on this forum warning people about it all of the time.


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

Thanks that was exactly what I needed!! A name brand reference QA1. I found a site Original Parts Group listed QA1 rear kits at about $750 and front a little less at $625. it said all hard wear included for compete install. They are asking for front end weight which I have no clue. I am pulling the motor and transmission for a overhaul but going back close to original only has about 65,000 miles on it but it sit outside in the weather for about 4 years before I got it back.


----------



## Noangelbuddy (Dec 6, 2017)

armyadarkness said:


> Well my global West arms were definitely designed and built in America out of American steel, by a guy named Doug who owns the company, and his personal car is a 64 GTO.
> 
> He has been racing GTOs on a road course for more than 40 years, and he's a huge contributor to the GTO community.
> 
> ...


I held off boxing my frame, even though I knew it flexed. I needed room to get my new transmission cross mount installed. Plan on welding in several steel supports in the open “C” area of the frame; while its on all fours. I don’t plan on Indy type driving or drifting so I think I will stick with what I have to see how the car handles before I make other changes. Who knows, tubular may be in my future; but not before a rear sway bar.


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

armyadarkness said:


> It's not and they do. Ive repaired a few. No worse job than overhead welding.


Now this would have been nice to know when I asked the original question!!


----------



## lust4speed (Jul 5, 2019)

Our early frames just are not up to the task regardless of how many band-aids are applied. Sticking on tubular A-arms with coil over suspension puts more stress on a frame that was never designed to handle it. Add a really big sway bar in front on our early A-bodies and you can be rewarded with the bumper edge digging into the fender because the front stringers can't be reinforced enough to prevent them from flexing. Been there, got the T-shirt.

I own what is basically a locomotive and the realization of that has pretty much kept me alive all these years. I go fast in a straight line, brake, enjoy the scenery through the corners, and then back on it in the straights. Another way to look at it is I can slightly push the car in corners and scare myself at a safe speed. If I could somehow make it handle like a new Vette, the speeds to obtain the same amount of seat pucker would be insane.

I have one friend in the club that purchased a complete Art Morrison chassis for his '65. Of course it set him back 26k and most of us would have problems turning loose of the cash. It will probably be another year before I get to see how the finished car comes out. That frame assembly is a piece of art and a shame it has to be covered up with car body.

Another club member doing a frame off restoration bought the complete kit that adds the inner frame support the whole length of the frame in addition to boxing. This not only stiffens up the frame but lowers the car with the same springs because he is adding about 250 pounds of added steel. At the drag races it will be just like he is going down the track with a passenger sitting next to him.

Purchasing Bilstein shocks was costly because now all my cars have to have them. Over the years I ran some well rated shocks and the previous set were KYB's -- just no comparison on how much better the Bilstein's are.


----------



## ylwgto (Oct 27, 2009)

Late to the party here, but I just redid my full suspension about 6 months ago. tubular controls arms front and rear, lowering springs, new shocks all around, full front end steering rebuild, new rear end, 4 wheel disc brake job. 

I did not see the advantage of a full coil over conversion when excellent suspension geometry correcting standard a arms and adjustable rear arms were available with high quality springds and shocks.

the car is like a completely new vehicle...if I could only get rid of all the squeaks and rattles!

Ping me if you want any details.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

2jamesb2 said:


> Now this would have been nice to know when I asked the original question!!


Well, in my opinion, that's exploited most with load levelers and air shocks, where the shock mount is not only supporting the car, but jacked and stressed under tension and load... I'd expect to see it far less with quality coil overs


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

lust4speed said:


> Purchasing Bilstein shocks was costly because now all my cars have to have them.


amen


----------



## O52 (Jan 27, 2019)

In addition to the GTO, I have Bilsteins on my Silverado and Express van. Made a big difference when towing my travel trailer.


----------



## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

2jamesb2 said:


> Now this would have been nice to know when I asked the original question!!


There are work arounds for it, if your heart is set on coil-overs


----------



## 2jamesb2 (Sep 15, 2021)

armyadarkness said:


> Well, in my opinion, that's exploited most with load levelers and air shocks, where the shock mount is not only supporting the car, but jacked and stressed under tension and load... I'd expect to see it far less with quality coil overs


Well I'm thinking pulling the trigger on the QA1 Coil-over conversion kits with the stock arms. I Also ordered the Wilwood front disc brakes. The original AC compressor went out in the mid 70s not needed in San Diego but a must have here in OKC. Remanufactured compressor instead of vintage air. The 17X8 front and 17x9 rear Rally II wheels came in yesterday need feed back on tires. I found out the new trunk lid and Hood are on backorder and due late July/August.


----------

