# 1969 GTO - Next steps? Advice requested



## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

I have a 1969 GTO that I have owned since 1987. From talking with others, it is a basic GTO in more of a Luxury trim. I put a chunk of money into rebuilding the motor in 1988 when I was younger. I always had the notion of a frame off restoration, but with kids to put in school and my free storage has come to end makes me ask, what do I do next? Should I rebuild and sell it or sell it as is? If the later, whats an old rusty 69 worth?

Here is what I have, and [please let me know what you think. I would like to get an honest price out of the car after having owned it this long.

1969 GTO VIN 242379Z130407
Blue with Blue interior
Disc Brakes
Hideaway Headlights
AC Car – the AC was removed when I got it…
Auto (400 - I think its original)
10 bolt (also original)
400 I believe its original - I bought it with a piston slapping - I had the 62 casting heads slightly ported and completely reworked, Bored .30, Crane Ram Air IV cam. Motor ran great when it was parked in 1990.
Truck and floorpan are in pretty good shape

I'm not sure if a numbers matching GTO with this Trim is special, but I am sure someone on this board knows.

Hers are a few pics. Let me know what you think. I pulled the spark plugs and turned the motor over just to make sure it had not seized up. I need to take a powerwasher to it and get some better images, but this will give you an idea of what I am working with.

Thank you!


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## 29585 (Aug 4, 2013)

Snakize, since you asked, Ill go ahead and give my comments. I welcome others conversation to agree or disagree. 

as always it all depends on the in detail condition which I could only see 1 photo of so I'll make a few assumptions about interior etc and tell you range of what I've bought these cars for. Please post a few more pics.

Assuming;
Interior; all there, door panels good, probably needs seat covers, maybe headliner, a thorough cleaning, new carpet.
Floor and Trunk; as you said if good shape means may need media blasting, patch panel welded here and there, etc.
Engine; sounds like may not need major overhaul, just needs to be brought back from hibernating
Panels; from your 1 photo looks like maybe needs some rear quarter skin welded in around wheelhouse, probably need some inner/outer wheellwell work, possibly trunk drop-offs typical.
Glass and Chrome: all glass useable, probably needs some new chrome moldings

to me I would do a medium level resto, pull body off frame, media blast frame, acidize, paint, body bushings, pull motor, clean engine compartment, paint, panel welding, body work, paint. 

Again, numbers match, motor and tranny good, I think this car is worth between $7-10k as-is (depending on the details). Im not looking to buy another one now but the last 2 I bought were in this range and they are getting harder and harder to find with numbers matching. If these numbers are way off what you were expecting to get for it then post some more pictures please.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

Thanks CPG! I'll try to get some lower res images to post as the ones I had were a too large of files. Its covered in a layer of grime from sitting for 30 years, but its all there save for the headliner. I pulled up chunks of the carpet that was in bad shape anyway just to make sure the floor pan was solid.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

and a few more. Clearly this car needs a good scrubbing.


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## 29585 (Aug 4, 2013)

hey Snakize, 
thanks for posting more pics, the car looks very workable just depends how much time you have on your hands whether to restore it yourself or sell it. Looks like it only needs the 1/4 panels work but I found that once you get into these things its like peeling an onion, there's always another layer of rust underneath. Good luck with it, let us know what you decide to do with it. If you decide to sell it there's a separate thread on this site for selling.
CPG


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## linden_gto (Jan 9, 2017)

i'll be honest, if it were me, i'd cut and run. any effort/money you put in, you likely will not retrieve 100% of, so why bother. life is short and family time is valuable. i'd sell and move on without investing more time into the project, but your circumstances will dictate if this is possible for you. i'd just want to move on - even though it looks very doable, that's a PROJECT. remove the rear quarters and before you know it, project A has turned into B, C, and D and then there's no turning back or you'd have to sell as a basket case.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

I appreciate both of your comments. I realize the whole onion issue and am fearful that I bite off more than I can chew. I can also appreciate that the car is worth more now to a person who see's it still assembled than if I end up selling it basket-case style no matter how many zip lock bags and totes I have labeled with all the parts and pieces. My biggest fear is the emotional attachment I have to the car and dumping money into a car and getting upside down. I know at some point if I sell this car I will buy one that has gone through a quality frame off restoration.

That said, what do you think a fair asking price for this project car would be. I'm thinking of it as my down payment for a restored 69. Is $7K to $10K a fair range. Maybe I should ask that question after I get the original rally's back on and the grime removed? Thanks again!


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## 29585 (Aug 4, 2013)

snakize, 

I agree with linden_gto about the time, and how you want to spend it is your decision. I can tell you my first gto i restored looked alot like this to begin with, (take a look at my garage pics ) plus needed a new floor. I decided to restore it cause I had the money and time, I had a job where I worked 2 weeks on/off so during my weeks at home while my son was at school I worked on the gto. I put about $10000 in parts and over 750 man-hrs work into it ( about 3 hrs/day for 250 days or so) took me like 3 years. I know restoration shops on TV knock these things out in 30 days but they may have 4 guys working 8hrs/day which is still about 640 man-hrs, AND they have a shop all set up for it. So time is a major question here.
CPG


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## linden_gto (Jan 9, 2017)

Snakize said:


> That said, what do you think a fair asking price for this project car would be. I'm thinking of it as my down payment for a restored 69. Is $7K to $10K a fair range. Maybe I should ask that question after I get the original rally's back on and the grime removed? Thanks again!


i'm hesitant to say that this car is worth that much. you're not certain of numbers matching, standard 400/auto, nothing particularly rare about the car... i think $7-10k is high. restorations can be very expensive and they tend to 'build' as you go along and costs can be difficult to control. a restoration, on something like this, is never a financial decision - you're much better off buying a car someone else restored to your standards. point being, with restorations being as expensive as they are, it tends to hammer the prices on vehicles needing restorations. i see some people paying prices i would never entertain for a resto candidate - they're in a losing situation from the get-go (buying on emotion). the market will tell you what something like this is worth. i would suggest you clean this thing up the best you possibly can and consider an auction. don't sell it 'as is' - put the effort in to make it look as feasible of a project as possible. you're looking for someone who had a blue/blue '69 in their past and they just have to have that vehicle again. that what i'd do - ymmv.


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## Pinion head (Jan 3, 2015)

Is the hood slightly kinked or have rust behind the scoops?
Does the deck lid need replaced/ pinholes of rust?
How about the dash assembly, is the top of the dash cracked? 

If this '69 was heavily loaded...AM-FM multiplex, 8 track, pwr antenna, pwr seat, tilt, woodwheel, rally guages, reclining pass seat, dlx belts, posi... Even needing all the above sheet metal replaced, if it was so loaded, I could see maybe $8000 -9000 as an adventurous project in today's market. I know of heavily loaded '69 GTO with those options that sold 2 years ago, as a project, in that price range, then 6 months later, the guy the bought it dumped out of it. unfortunately, I don't see the attraction of those options in this '69. My take is, if you can clean it up & can get 6-7K, you've done real good, it would be real easy to get 40K in restoring the blue '69, thats with many wholesale parts connections, & when done, am talking a decent driver/ local showcar, not anywhere near a Concours showcar. Better to clean it up & roll it, then if still in the market, buy something with much higher upside, a car, that if you have to get out of it in 5-10 years, the vehicle will have appreciated.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

I would try to get it running as a running car will fetch a higher price. Not running, you can say anything about the engine, produce receipts, etc., but to me that would not be a sales point for me as I don't know you or your machinist so I would pull the engine and tear it down and go from there.

Hard to price the car on photos alone, but in my eyes it looks solid. I am not one for a restoration, so a resto-mod of some sort would be my choice where it does not have to be original and don't have to sink $25K into the car and be upside down. I'd clean it up, do a some patch panel work, shoot a coat of black primer, get it mechanically sound/safe, and enjoy it. 

I think 5-8K would be a saleable price range with the higher end if it were running. In any case, always sell high and negotiate from there. Now is a good time to sell with income tax returns coming in and summer around the corner.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

Thanks everyone for your comments. It helps take the emotions out of it and think rationally. I have kept this car for so long that it pains me to sell it, but admittedly I do not have 750 hours to dedicate to doing the bulk of the work. That said, I want to get a fair price, not gouge anyone, but also do not leave money on the table because I did not know the market price for the car. Should I get PHS documentation and verify that the motor, tranny and rear end are all original? Will that help the car sell or a waste of time and money?


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

" Should I get PHS documentation and verify that the motor, tranny and rear end are all original? Will that help the car sell or a waste of time and money?"

Yes, get it. The more original the car is with its factory parts & ID numbers, the higher the resale value. The documentation takes the guess work out for both you and the potential buyer.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

Thanks Jim. Lots of numbers on the car, what numbers are important in verifying? 

Engine #where is it located?
Does Tranny have a #where is it located?
Rear # where is it located?

I have already found a replacement GTO that is restored so I think my motivation for a good down payment has me more excited to make sure and do this car justice and document it. Getting it running is another matter as the quadrajet was replaced by a Holley 750DP and that will need to be rebuilt or replaced for sure.


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## Snakize (Feb 20, 2017)

Any help pointing me to a past thread on locating the numbers for the engine, tranny and rear end to verify number s matching would be appreciated. Thx


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## 29585 (Aug 4, 2013)

hey snakize, good luck on ebay today. I think I see your car there. I'm also watching cause I've got one that's similar I may be selling soon.

CPG


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Snakize said:


> Any help pointing me to a past thread on locating the numbers for the engine, tranny and rear end to verify number s matching would be appreciated. Thx


Google up 'Pontiac Engine Codes', etc. There are several sites out there with the information. You can also use the search tool here to find threads.

Bear


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