# "The next-generation GTO is Definitely dead."



## C5ORGTO (Dec 30, 2004)

Ok, I hope this isn't old news, but I got my March Motor Trend today. In the new Camaro article is said "The next-generation GTO is Definitely dead." Disappointing?,,, somewhat, but it makes our cars more rare. I may buy the new Camaro in a few years. We will see.


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## GTPprix (Mar 29, 2005)

Not true..


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## C5ORGTO (Dec 30, 2004)

I hope you are right.


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## J.E.T. (Sep 30, 2005)

Maybe not "dead" but gone for a few years for sure. No '07 is what I was told at the dealership last week. Guess they should be in the know on this.

JET


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

I REALLY like the looks of the new Camaro. I hate that they'll be axing the GTO again, but I'm not sure they could top the camaro design. I have heard these rumors of a 4-door GTO, I would rather the GTO disappear altogether again than become a 4-door failure like the Charger. Either way, by '09 whenever the Camaro comes out, I should be about due for a new car...hopefully it won't be butchered much compared to the concept. Things have a way of changing for the worse between concept and production. What I'd really like to see is our engine (or the LS7) in a lighter car, priced at or around $30k. It would surely be a mustang GT500 killer and would allow GM to hang on to the performance crown for a few more years. Plus, getting 30+ mpg on the highway thanks to being able to shut some cylinders off will make the Camaro virtually irresistable when compared to the Mustang. Even the whimpy 6-banger mustang doesn't even get 30 mpg!


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## lotaguts (Jan 17, 2006)

I must add that if anyone can afford to get rid of this vehicle in 2009 three years away from now and pick up another toy to replace this one more power to them. I cannot imagine getting rid of my new 05 for at least the life of my loan 6 years even if I wanted to I would probably be so upside down. Six years from now I think this will still be one of the hottest vehicles on the road and beyond that. I plan on keeping mine for a long time because even if I did not I would have no choice. My truck which I traded in for the goat was a 2000 silverado which until this day would roast a lot of vehicles on the road today and was still fun to drive and I am multiplying that excitement x 100 with the GTO.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

I have heard the next gen. GTO is a go from some sorces and it is not from others. :willy: Time will tell.I do agree with lotaguts who was talking about keeping the car for awhile because he is stuck in payments.(beats being stuck with a Cobolt or a Focas payment) It'll be 6 years from 2004 when I own my 04. When I see a 6 year old Trans Am on the road:STILL PRETTY COOL!!
I'm sure in 6 years I'll get a similiar reaction to my goat,even though there will be newer stuff out there.


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## GTO_400 (Jul 7, 2005)

Don't think I'll go with the Camaro, but that new Challenger sure looks sweeeet! But I wouldn’t trade the goat for it...but that's what I said when I took my Silverado in for some warrantee work and drove the GTO home, I guess never say never!


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

In 2009, I will have 1 year left on my loan, if that. I typically make double payments to help keep down the interest as well. Either way, the way I drive, it'll be a miracle if the GTO holds up 5 years unless they're built a LOT better than I think they are. I've had my GTO about two months now and I've put 7100 miles on it. Most of my cars end up with 75k miles on 'em within just 2-3 years.


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

The Camero is sweet but who's to say it's really going to be "all that." What I would like to see is the Trans-Am come back!


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

Yeah, that's what I meant earlier, it could change dramatically by the time it goes into final production. More than one car has been ruined between the concept and production phase.
I've owned 3 Trans Ams in my life and I'd own another one in a hearbeat if they continued to be one of the fastest, coolest cars around.


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

More evidence that GM is planning on kicking the plug out from the machine keeping _P-P-_Pontiac alive....

One of the smarter things they can do.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

Groucho said:


> More evidence that GM is planning on kicking the plug out from the machine keeping _P-P-_Pontiac alive....
> 
> One of the smarter things they can do.


It's smart not to keep Pontiac alive?!


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## spykesta (Nov 4, 2005)

I gotta agree with LOTAGUTS about keeping my car till it's paid off, I also traded in a 2000 Navigator with over 100k and I hadnt even paid off that yet, (it was used).

But I certainly hope the General keeps the GTO there is room for a real 4 passenger coupe in their Lineup even with the Camaro, Gotta give people a choice. If they had done it right and designed the GTO using only the Holden platform but putting the sheetmetal on it that would have nailed the GTO look and making it in the states, we wouldnt be having this discussion and these things would have sold 10 times the numbers they did. But I still think my Goat is a awesome ride.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

What if it was never labled GTO in the first place, but was called the "Pontiac Monaro" Think it would have sold any better or worse?
:confused


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## fergyflyer (Apr 18, 2005)

Groucho said:


> More evidence that GM is planning on kicking the plug out from the machine keeping _P-P-_Pontiac alive....
> 
> One of the smarter things they can do.


A year ago you and I got into it over Pontiac. At that time I thought it was a mistake to kill it. It had some heritage that was worth saving. I still feel the same way, but I don't think GM can pull it off in their current shape. 

Look at the writing on the wall. Pontiac has the Solstice, but Saturn has the Sky. Pontiac didn't get a full-size this go around. The G6 isn't selling as expected. The GTO is done for at least a year and a half and there is talk it is gone for good. The Grand Prix isn't doing too well. There really isn't much else to say. If Pontiac went away after 2006, most of the models and the sales they generate could be recovered at other GM brands. Why keep the added expense of a brand that doesn't generate increased sales and might be hurting GM's bottom line?


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## MACHINE HEAD (Dec 11, 2005)

PEARL JAM said:


> What if it was never labled GTO in the first place, but was called the "Pontiac Monaro" Think it would have sold any better or worse?
> :confused


I think it would of been worse, GTO is what sold me


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## fergyflyer (Apr 18, 2005)

PEARL JAM said:


> What if it was never labled GTO in the first place, but was called the "Pontiac Monaro" Think it would have sold any better or worse?
> :confused


I'd bet the whole Holden line brought into the US as a Brand would have helped GM. The only thing stopping that was an agreement with the UAW limiting the amount of Australian cars to 18,000. 

The Pontiac GTO was the right name for the car though. It is true to what the original was for it's time, a mid-sized high powered GT car.


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## silver/red/04 (Aug 22, 2005)

I think pearl jam has a point ,when people heard GTO they wanted retro.I think if it would had a different name it would have sold better.I can't tell you the number of times somebody told me it just doesn't look like a GTO.


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## lotaguts (Jan 17, 2006)

I dont care if this thing was called a sunfire if its got 400 horses, incredible interior, awesome ride I would of still bought it. Who cares about retro I think its a cool design although would not base my purchasing options on it. Dont you guys like the sleeper effect this car looks sorta like a Grand Am/Prix on steriods I love it when I pull up someone at a light and they have no idea what this thing is and I roast them. If this car had a retro look everyone and there mother would no what it was.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

lotaguts said:


> I dont care if this thing was called a sunfire if its got 400 horses, incredible interior, awesome ride I would of still bought it. Who cares about retro I think its a cool design although would not base my purchasing options on it. Dont you guys like the sleeper effect this car looks sorta like a Grand Am/Prix on steriods I love it when I pull up someone at a light and they have no idea what this thing is and I roast them. If this car had a retro look everyone and there mother would no what it was.


:agree You basically summed up the point I was trying to get across earlier. I don't care if it was called the "PONTIAC X". I WOULD HAVE BOUGHT IT!! It still would have had to be a Pontiac, though. Despite some people's prejudices I'm loyal to the Pontiac name plate(as long as they offer a RWD v8).:cool


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## noz34me (Dec 15, 2005)

silver/red/04 said:


> I think pearl jam has a point ,when people heard GTO they wanted retro.I think if it would had a different name it would have sold better.I can't tell you the number of times somebody told me it just doesn't look like a GTO.


Who's to say what a 2005 GTO would look like if they never dropped the line at all? It's possible it could have evolved into something close to what we have. Look at what the Mustang has looked like over the years before they finally went "back in time" and got it right again.

The Challenger concept looks like it does because it hasn't been built for many years, and the new concept can take it's cues from the original.


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## BlownGTO (Dec 9, 2005)

Dont believe everything you read. Considering the fact that GM will already have a RWD Platform for the Camaro, I doubt they wont make a version for "The Excitement Division" aka Pontiac. Dont count the GTO out yet IMO.


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## QSGTO (Nov 21, 2005)

I love it because it's a sleeper and the cops don't put me in their laser sights, but a lot of people have commented that it looks like a BMW from the front and sides or a 95 Mustang from the side.


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

fergyflyer said:


> A year ago you and I got into it over Pontiac. At that time I thought it was a mistake to kill it. It had some heritage that was worth saving. I still feel the same way, but I don't think GM can pull it off in their current shape.
> 
> Look at the writing on the wall. Pontiac has the Solstice, but Saturn has the Sky. Pontiac didn't get a full-size this go around. The G6 isn't selling as expected. The GTO is done for at least a year and a half and there is talk it is gone for good. The Grand Prix isn't doing too well. There really isn't much else to say. If Pontiac went away after 2006, most of the models and the sales they generate could be recovered at other GM brands. Why keep the added expense of a brand that doesn't generate increased sales and might be hurting GM's bottom line?


_Exactly._

Welcome to my way of thinking.  

Not gonna restate what I've been saying for over a year now, but it's inevitable...Pontiac has been a joke for so long that the brand no longer carries a cachet worth keeping...I bought the car despite it the fact that it came with the red wedgie on it, and I know that I'm not alone. GM simply can't afford the duplication of vehicles in their line-up. Introduction of our cars as a GTO was a valiant effort, but it was too little, too late, and marketed incredible poorly (I will not restate my contention that branding the Holden Monaro as a GTO was their first mistake, however).

Face it, Worshippers of the Red Wedgie.

Put a fork in it. It's _done_.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

noz34me said:


> Who's to say what a 2005 GTO would look like if they never dropped the line at all? It's possible it could have evolved into something close to what we have.


If my memory serves me correctly(and it very rarely does) that was one of Pontiac's advertising points for the 2004 model."It is an evolution of the GTO if production had never ceased."


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

PEARL JAM said:


> If my memory serves me correctly(and it very rarely does) that was one of Pontiac's advertising points for the 2004 model."It is an evolution of the GTO if production had never ceased."


_C'mon._ And Keebler cookies are actually made in a tree by little elves.

The car was designed in Australia by Australians to be built for the Australian market. WTF does that have to do with Pontiac _anything?_


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

Groucho said:


> _C'mon._ WTF does that have to do with Pontiac _anything?_


As I said: THATS HOW PONTIAC ADVERTISED IT.
Like it or not,dude, if you own a new GTO YOU OWN A PONTIAC.Says so on the window sticker,and the VIN.
I for one am proud to be one of these PONTIAC owners.:cool


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

PEARL JAM said:


> As I said: THATS HOW PONTIAC ADVERTISED IT.
> Like it or not,dude, if you own a new GTO YOU OWN A PONTIAC.Says so on the window sticker,and the VIN.
> I for one am proud to be one of these PONTIAC owners.:cool


...a Pontiac owner who buys cookies from strange little men living in a tree.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

Groucho said:


> ...a Pontiac owner who buys cookies from strange little men living in a tree.


 WTF?:confused 
Where is this tree? Can you take some pictures?
Elves are not real. The grey aliens told me so.


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

PEARL JAM said:


> WTF?:confused
> Where is this tree? Can you take some pictures?
> Elves are not real. The grey aliens told me so.


No can do.

Everybody knows Elves have left the building.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

Groucho said:


> No can do.
> 
> Everybody knows Elves have left the building.


HEHE! lol good one,brother!


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

PEARL JAM said:


> HEHE! lol good one,brother!


:cheers 

I have my moments.


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

I have owned numerous pontiacs over the years, and I have loved nearly every one of them. It will be a shame to see 'em go, but moving to a chevy really won't be THAT big of a switch, I mean they've practically always been the same thing anyway.
The new camaro is sweet and should be FAST...that's just the way I like 'em. :cheers


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## fergyflyer (Apr 18, 2005)

That leaves us with the real question of the day. Groucho, would you buy a Holden badged as a Chevy?????


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## BigNick (Jan 7, 2005)

GM didn't call it a Holden Monaro when they brought it over, because of the fate of the XR4Ti and Scorpio that Ford sold over here as a "Merkur".

Though they lasted a couple years in the US market longer than the Monaro/GTO.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

BigNick said:


> GM didn't call it a Holden Monaro when they brought it over, because of the fate of the XR4Ti and Scorpio that Ford sold over here as a "Merkur".
> 
> Though they lasted a couple years in the US market longer than the Monaro/GTO.


The Merkur was a good performance car for it's time. It's odd how "displaced" vehicles like that (and the new Holden GTO) dont ever seem to gain popularity, despite their performance superiorarity.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

fergyflyer said:


> That leaves us with the real question of the day. Groucho, would you buy a Holden badged as a Chevy?????


I'm curious about that ,also.
Would you refer to it as a C-C-chevy?:lol:


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## Groucho (Sep 11, 2004)

PEARL JAM said:


> The Merkur was a good performance car for it's time. It's odd how "displaced" vehicles like that (and the new Holden GTO) dont ever seem to gain popularity, despite their performance superiorarity.


Yep. A buddy of mine had an XR4Ti ("Exrati")....bitchen little Bimmer slayer. I loved driving that car. They were a failure not because of poor product, but because the parent company had a hot performance car with a clueless marketing strategy....Similar to the situation with GTOs we have.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

Groucho said:


> Yep. A buddy of mine had an XR4Ti ("Exrati")....bitchen little Bimmer slayer. I loved driving that car. They were a failure not because of poor product, but because the parent company had a hot performance car with a clueless marketing strategy....Similar to the situation with GTOs we have.


:agree 100freakin%
GM's build it and they will come thinking will be it's end. Everywhere I look I see Mustangs. Billboard, magazines, fast food game give aways,ect. To this day I have NEVER seen a GTO add except online. The average 26 year old will most likely buy the car he thinks is most popular.


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

PEARL JAM said:


> :agree 100freakin%
> GM's build it and they will come thinking will be it's end. Everywhere I look I see Mustangs. Billboard, magazines, fast food game give aways,ect. To this day I have NEVER seen a GTO add except online. The average 26 year old will most likely buy the car he thinks is most popular.


 You are absolutely right! Being a new car director for a Pontiac dealership, it fustrates the heck out of me that GM doesn't do more advertising for Pontiac...especially the GTO!!! We definitely have a better product but it's all about perception and name brand recognition!


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

Yeah, but the word of mouth advertising about the GTO is fantastic. I can't stop at this little gas station outside of town without getting asked questions about my GTO. One guy asked me "So, will it really do 200 miles per hour?". Oh how I wanted to say "hell yeah it will!"...
I'd say 8 out of the last 10 times I've gotten gas there I had someone ask me a question about it. They knew EXACTLY what it was...so Pontiac is getting some advertising from somewhere/someone (besides me)!


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

That's my point! People see the car and they want to know more about it! Imagine what would happen if Pontaic decided to advertise and show the car more! Don't get me wrong, I LOVE talking to people about my GTO and the looks I get driving it, but I would like to sell more of them!


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

Well, if I win the lottery, I'll buy all the GTOs on your lot, ok? 

Apparently, you didn't see that little advertisement called "The Last Ride", which was a 1.5 hour long Pontiac GTO ad. hehe


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

I Love You!!!!


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

lol, I think I'm more likely to get struck by lightning, twice, while being attacked by a shark in Missouri. 
However, you may hold me to my word. haha


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## x-stanger (Jun 24, 2005)

GM is run like a last place sports team , lots of reasons why they are failing but the general public does not care anymore.The GTO needed GM to make a commitment to this car which they can't .If GM made 500 GTO's then maybe the car would be collectable in 30 years.Now it will lose value much faster for lack of market.That's to bad because it had alot going for it.


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

x-stanger said:


> GM is run like a last place sports team , lots of reasons why they are failing but the general public does not care anymore.The GTO needed GM to make a commitment to this car which they can't .If GM made 500 GTO's then maybe the car would be collectable in 30 years.Now it will lose value much faster for lack of market.That's to bad because it had alot going for it.


I don't nessacarily believe that's true. ALL of the domestic names (GM, Ford, Dodge) don't exactly have a great marketshare at this time. It's mainly due to the fact that the imports and the media have just constantly bashed the heck out of us that it's a difficult rebound. You hardly hear of Toyota having a recall, but they have them, and it barely makes the news. Yet if a domestic auto maker has one, it's usually glaring on the front page. It's ashame, because the 3 domestic automakers have just as good of a product as the imports now but the damage has been done!


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## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

baron_iv said:


> Well, if I win the lottery, I'll buy all the GTOs on your lot, ok?
> 
> Apparently, you didn't see that little advertisement called "The Last Ride", which was a 1.5 hour long Pontiac GTO ad. hehe


Thanks.

Just bought the GTO DVD for $8.68


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

I can't find the DVD


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## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

DallasSleeper said:


> I can't find the DVD



Amazon has it for about $18.00 ...I bought mine new at half.com

http://product.half.ebay.com/The-Last-Ride_W0QQtgZinfoQQprZ30949924


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

thanks, I don't know why I didn't think about that.


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## PEARL JAM (Sep 6, 2005)

GOOD SIGNITURE,DallasSleeper:cool


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

Thank you very much.:cheers


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

That really is a great signature...Thank you for all you do BTW!


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

I appreciate it, but it is actually all I used to do, I am 10 days away from being an unemployed civilian.


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## dealernut (Oct 22, 2005)

GOATGIRL said:


> That really is a great signature...Thank you for all you do BTW!


He doesn't do anything now. YA SLACKA!!!!!!


BTW - I am still going to call you sarge when you get out.


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

dealernut said:


> He doesn't do anything now. YA SLACKA!!!!!!
> 
> 
> BTW - I am still going to call you sarge when you get out.


That's the pot calling the kettle black BIG ERN!!!!:rofl: 

Congratulations on your discharge!arty:


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## raven1124 (Sep 23, 2005)

DallasSleeper said:


> thanks, I don't know why I didn't think about that.


If you're looking for a good movie you're not going to get it with this one but the footage of the goat is pretty good.


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

I remember watching it on TV, the acting and story was questionable to say the least. But the car scenes..... Sooooo sweet

Big Ern calling me a slacker :rofl:


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## dealernut (Oct 22, 2005)

GOATGIRL said:


> That's the pot calling the kettle black BIG ERN!!!!:rofl:
> 
> Congratulations on your discharge!arty:



OH yeah!!!!!


OK I see how it is. 


Sarge buy the one in California, since I don't do anything!!!!! HAHAHA!!!!!!


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

the true side comes out now. I see the PMS was contageous.:lol:


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

DallasSleeper said:


> the true side comes out now. I see the PMS was contageous.:lol:


My contribution to society, contageous PMS!!!!:cheers Sarge, you can still buy it here, I'll take care of you!


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

GOATGIRL said:


> My contribution to society, contageous PMS!!!!:cheers Sarge, you can still buy it here, I'll take care of you!


I remember the last woman that said she would take care of me, I am still paying her child support...


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

Crash And Burn!!!!:shutme


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

:rofl:


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## BlownGTO (Dec 9, 2005)

:willy:


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

wow a guy can't even joke around here...:confused


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## BlownGTO (Dec 9, 2005)

DallasSleeper said:


> wow a guy can't even joke around here...:confused


I thought it was hilarious, props!


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

Thank you, I try my best.:cheers


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

Sorry guys...I am at work right now so occasionally I do HAVE to work...unlike BIG ERN! tee hee!


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## DallasSleeper (Jan 3, 2006)

I want his job


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## GOATGIRL (Feb 6, 2006)

:cheers


DallasSleeper said:


> I want his job


I'll let him know! :rofl::cheers


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## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

raven1124 said:


> If you're looking for a good movie you're not going to get it with this one but the footage of the goat is pretty good.


Got it for the GTO footage  Not expecting a "Sister My Sister" a "Ju Dou" or an "Elvira Madigan" out of it.


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## baron_iv (Nov 17, 2005)

You can also get The Last Ride from bittorrent, which probably isn't the most legal way to do things...but it's fast and cheap.
The movie is actually rather bad. It does have a few very cool cars though. Chase scenes are great, they do a decent job of showing off the GTO's capabilities. The poor cops don't have a chance.


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## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

*The Last Ride*

Just watched it! 

1 star for the movie
4 stars for the 04 GTO
5 stars for the butt of Nadine Velazquez


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