# What Headers yield the highest RWHP Increase?



## Phantom2004 (Sep 18, 2005)

What Headers yield the highest RWHP Increase? :confused 

#1) Kooks-Long Tube Headers with High Flow Cats?

#2) Stainless Steel Works-Long Tube Headers with High Flow Cats?

#3) SLP-Long Tube Headers with High Flow Cats?

#4) Dyna-Tech-Long Tube Headers with High Flow Cats?

Which will give me the highest RWHP Increase? :confused 

Of these 4 sets that are well known, is there any Dyno tests done comparing them? 

Please Help, have about $1,500:cool burning a hole in my pocket, must spend on headers!!! arty:


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

I personally hate Kooks and Stainless Works.... I have the SLP's on my car and love them! And I sell them (w/cats, ceramic coated headers) for $999.00 which is cheaper than anyone else..... :cheers


----------



## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> I personally hate Kooks and Stainless Works.... I have the SLP's on my car and love them! And I sell them (w/cats, ceramic coated headers) for $999.00 which is cheaper than anyone else..... :cheers


Good price! SLP are my 1st choice. I only had one question though...w/ cats, are there bungs for all 4 sensors. I just ask because I remember seeing them listed at one site where it mentions harness extensions and the need for O2 simulators, even for the P/N w/ cats...


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

Yes it has all 4 provisions for the O2's, however, on the 05's I would recommend a tune if you have any other mods done..... they sometimes throw a lean code (on all headers for 05's....).


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

Hmm, im gonna ask this just for the sake of it. Do you think a tune is required for long tubes, catback, CAI and a 3200 stall?

On an 05 mind you.


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

big_mike said:


> Hmm, im gonna ask this just for the sake of it. Do you think a tune is required for long tubes, catback, CAI and a 3200 stall?
> 
> On an 05 mind you.


Yes, on the 05's the programming will let the car run too lean (I've seen this on a few of my customers cars), it can't compensate for the increase in airflow. Besides, the car will come alive with just those four mods and a tune! :cheers


----------



## ModBoss2 (Nov 13, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> Yes it has all 4 provisions for the O2's, however, on the 05's I would recommend a tune if you have any other mods done..... they sometimes throw a lean code (on all headers for 05's....).


Yeah, within a few days I'll actually have my cat-back installed [the CAI is already installed], but I was figuring I'd be able to wait until after the LTs are installed before I had it tuned.


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> Yes, on the 05's the programming will let the car run too lean (I've seen this on a few of my customers cars), it can't compensate for the increase in airflow. Besides, the car will come alive with just those four mods and a tune! :cheers


hehe, THAT is the idea. 

lesseeee, 

long tubes ($1000)
catback ($500)
CAI ($250)
3200 stall ($800)

$2550 is my estimate, maybe you can give me a package deal for 2k eh Steve?

Wait, what am I doing, I gotta get the damn thing first!


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

big_mike said:


> hehe, THAT is the idea.
> 
> lesseeee,
> 
> ...


Catback is more than $500, it's more like $650 and up.....


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

not at the shop I would be going to. He did dual 3" stainless on the vette with 2 chambers, welded, for $500. Took him 3 hours.


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

Seems like everyone I talk to has their opinion about which are the best. So I'm at a loss too on which to buy. Rev Extreme inTampa/Brandon says the SLP's are junk, go with SW's, they are better made. Jesus someone help me decide B4 I spend $1k on headers. I personally thought the SLP would be better since they are coated. HELP!!!!!!!! Another company said the JBA mid lengths are good. I have money burning a hole in my pocket, wanna buy headers soon........so which ones?


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

big_mike said:


> not at the shop I would be going to. He did dual 3" stainless on the vette with 2 chambers, welded, for $500. Took him 3 hours.


I'd be willing to bet they weren't mandrel bends.... I only use quality exhaust on my cars, if it's $150 more then so be it....


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

crap, thought I had the pics on my server. I will have them up when I get home, around 3pm, and you can see that they WERE mandrel bends. Honest!


----------



## Nemisis (Nov 4, 2005)

I'm no expert by any means, but any of those headers are gonna be within a couple of hp of each other. As long as you get some longtubes you'll be doing good. I've seen some people say how good jba's were and they gave them so much power, but I think the truth is that they had never had their car dyno'd previously or had a tune until they got the headers installed. So when they get them installed and then do tuning they think, man 30+ rwhp, when probably 20 of that was tuning alone. Just my .02.


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

if most of the gain is from a tune, doesn't seem worth the $1k for that little a gain. Maybe I'm wrong.


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

All I can say is I've seen/worked on my fair share of new GTO's and I'm telling you, it's really hard to beat the fit/finish of the SLP's..... I wouldn't use them on Fatbitch if I didn't trust them.....


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

I guess the question is, how fast do you wanna go right? I just need to know if it's worth the money for the LT's and a tune or just get a tune?:confused


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

Longtubes and a tune, anytime you can improve the intake/exhaust airflow it will help the car make more power! You will not be sorry! :cheers


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

for a GREAT audio clip of SLP longtubes on a LS1, check this video out. He also had a corsa catback.

http://68.34.235.230/Movies/ben_burnout_possum.mpg


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

Allright.........you made up my mind! LOL! I'll be calling you next week! I hope I still have your #. Oh BTW, love the B&M shifter! Reverse is working normally now. So far no leaks or loose bolts!:cheers


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

marathonman said:


> Allright.........you made up my mind! LOL! I'll be calling you next week! I hope I still have your #. Oh BTW, love the B&M shifter! Reverse is working normally now. So far no leaks or loose bolts!:cheers


AWESOME! :cheers


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

nobody liked the movie?


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

Damn I can't see it! I'll have to try from home, my laptop just sits on "connecting", but won't play!


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

give it time, a LOT of people are hitting up that server.


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

When I click on it, it says 5 hr 17 min to download... feck that....


----------



## marathonman (Jun 21, 2005)

:lol: I didn't even get that far!


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

maybe I should not have posted it over on LS1GTO.com huh?

tell ya what... I will move it to a new folder and only tell you guys about it.


----------



## gameover (May 13, 2005)

Well I see you've already made up your mind but I'll still give my .02.
Kooks makes one of, if not the best headers out there. I know Steve disagrees but I can honestly say they made a world of difference on my car and the workmanship is awesome! :cheers


----------



## 04m6_ca (Feb 27, 2005)

*Are they 50 state legal?*

I would like to get the SLP long tube headers and hi-flow cats, pkg that GTODEALER has, but have two questions. Are they California SMOG legal (do they have CARB numbers)? and will I notice a difference if I don't get a tune?


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> I personally hate Kooks and Stainless Works.... I have the SLP's on my car and love them! And I sell them (w/cats, ceramic coated headers) for $999.00 which is cheaper than anyone else..... :cheers


yep i got these from my pal steve and he hooked me the fuk up my car not as loud as others"steve" but its not quiet
:cheers


----------



## Nemisis (Nov 4, 2005)

All I was saying is that longtubes are far superiors over shorty headers like JBA, with longtubes and a tune your looking at around 40rwhp easily. I picked up 26rwhp and 30lb ft tq from tuning, but I also had a cai that may have needed to be tuned just a little so all in all, you may even see more, good luck!


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

The only headers that are CARB approved are the JBA shorties, if you live in Cali you're stuck with these.


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

big_mike said:


> for a GREAT audio clip of SLP longtubes on a LS1, check this video out. He also had a corsa catback.
> 
> http://68.34.235.230/Movies/ben_burnout_possum.mpg


and










shows that my vette had mandrel bent pipes. 

Now, enjoy the movie!


----------



## dotocomo (Sep 13, 2004)

*take out converter*

Guys, just my 10 cents worth (or should i say dime)

In New Zealand and Australia you dot need catalytic converters so as a suggestion has anyone taken these out and just put a free flow exhaust say with 12 inch resonators + headers (did that on my 3 litre straight six, one 2 & half inch exhaust - Holden Commodore - GM)

Sounds a bit loud but am sure you'd get HP boost.

And from what i know they hardly check the converters even if you left it in but just emptied out the junk in the middle to pass a basic inspection?

What do you reckon?


----------



## GTODEALER (Jan 7, 2005)

Mike that is not mandrel bends.... and your video shows 3hr 10min to load on a T1....
This is mandrel bent....








...notice the pipe doesn't indent in the bend radius, less restriction!


----------



## edysinger (Nov 23, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> Yes it has all 4 provisions for the O2's, however, on the 05's I would recommend a tune if you have any other mods done..... they sometimes throw a lean code (on all headers for 05's....).


In addition, since you are opening up the backpressure, you are affecting the internal EGR, therefore increasing the chance for spark knock.


----------



## Guest (Dec 1, 2005)

OK, download the video from here, they have a MUCH faster speed.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=SCCTAW3E


----------



## YouHolden? (Jun 29, 2005)

I to am about to invest in a full exhaust, as soon as I sell my other car,
(a 1966 dodge coronet w/ a 440 if anyone is interested).

I still need it to be street legal, but I am having a hard time deciding on headers. So any advice on that would be helpful- I need the most gain with the least hassle.
As for cat backs, I was looking at the new Borla exhaust but some people seem to think its more cost effective to put in new mufflers. Anyone have any advice on that?

I also plan on getting the B&G springs w/ koni yellows package from gravanatuning, has anyone tried that setup?


----------



## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

Nemisis said:


> All I was saying is that longtubes are far superiors over shorty headers like JBA, with longtubes and a tune your looking at around 40rwhp easily. I picked up 26rwhp and 30lb ft tq from tuning, but I also had a cai that may have needed to be tuned just a little so all in all, you may even see more, good luck!


Yeah the long tubes give you better results than the shorties. Man it sucks being limited by Cali's emissions bull. But all in all, I got decent results with the JBA ceramic shorties, LPE CAI, Magnaflow catback w/ x pipe and a conservative tune. *365/363* at the wheels. *370/370* was obtainable but that would have put me right at the edge of detonation.


----------



## itsjoelr (Nov 23, 2005)

big_mike said:


> OK, download the video from here, they have a MUCH faster speed.
> 
> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=SCCTAW3E



Painfully sloooowwwww!!!!

111Mbps, is this a feature length film?


----------



## HoldenGTO (Nov 22, 2005)

hey Big Mike, who is that in your avatar? That isn't nitro girl, is it??


----------



## itsjoelr (Nov 23, 2005)

GTODEALER said:


> Longtubes and a tune, anytime you can improve the intake/exhaust airflow it will help the car make more power! You will not be sorry! :cheers



I'll be the first to admit I am auto challenged. I'm a GEEK who wants to learn more about cars. I do love my new '05 black GTO though. Taking her for a spin in the AM.....

All of these mods that every one's talking about, what do they to the manufactures warranty? Headers, CAT backs, CAIs, tuning etc.....
I have a couple of bucks and wanted to make my GTO faster and sound like the monster that it is. What do you guys/gals recommend? 

Also, I'm waiting for a wide body kit before I spend $$$$ on wheels and tires. Any ideas on where and when the real body kits (not Pontiacs) will hit the market for the 05s?


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

HoldenGTO said:


> hey Big Mike, who is that in your avatar? That isn't nitro girl, is it??


*whistles*

YES, YES IT IS !!!


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

itsjoelr said:


> I'll be the first to admit I am auto challenged. I'm a GEEK who wants to learn more about cars. I do love my new '05 black GTO though. Taking her for a spin in the AM.....
> 
> All of these mods that every one's talking about, what do they to the manufactures warranty? Headers, CAT backs, CAIs, tuning etc.....
> I have a couple of bucks and wanted to make my GTO faster and sound like the monster that it is. What do you guys/gals recommend?
> ...


couple hundred bucks to go faster, but not void warranty. OK, get yourself a cold air kit, custom tune, and a new set of mufflers. Should get you an honest 40-50 more hp at the tires. You will still have your warranty, but have a bit more power and a good sounding ride too!


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

itsjoelr said:


> Painfully sloooowwwww!!!!
> 
> 111Mbps, is this a feature length film?


its probably one of the BEST videos of a LS1 with SLP long tubes, corsa catback, medium sized cam on the net!


----------



## HoldenGTO (Nov 22, 2005)

big_mike said:


> *whistles*
> 
> YES, YES IT IS !!!


  WOW!


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

thats what I said when I saw the pics in my email.

DAYUM!!!!


----------



## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

big_mike said:


> couple hundred bucks to go faster, but not void warranty. OK, get yourself a cold air kit, custom tune, and a new set of mufflers. *Should get you an honest 40-50 more hp at the tires.* You will still have your warranty, but have a bit more power and a good sounding ride too!


Trust me. You will not get that much. Realistically, maybe 20-25 at the wheels. Maybe even 30 if the tune is pushed to the limit.


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

I have seen users gain 20-25 on a tune alone, so by adding a cold air and a nice free flow set of mufflers another 20-25 seemed realistic.


----------



## gameover (May 13, 2005)

big_mike said:


> I have seen users gain 20-25 on a tune alone, so by adding a cold air and a nice free flow set of mufflers another 20-25 seemed realistic.


Most of what they gain from the tune is because of the 45 min. cool down between the base run and the "tuned" run. aka dyno tricks.


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

well, im far from new to dyno tuning but most of my experience is with the LT1 and LS1. I was told the LS2 runs hotter than usual. So I figured with all the variables considered, 40hp min was a good gain considering the mods.

But hey, if I am wrong, im wrong. I know on my LT1 I did 277 with stock tuning and then 5 minutes later after downloading from the HPP, I went 293. And that wasnt even a custom tune!


----------



## Nemisis (Nov 4, 2005)

I gained 26rwhp and 30lbft of tq from tuning, but I also had cai, so that I'm sure had a little bit to do with it. All of my dyno runs were made within an hour and my car had sat for nearly 45mins before they even did a base run, base run was 330/333, final run was 356/363, and this is with 900 miles only. So my plan was to wait til about 3000 miles take it back and put her back on the dyno and see if she was making anymore power due to breaking in or whatever you want to call it, if so then great, if not then at least I know and I can start other mods. I think the reason so many people so inflated numbers for some mods is because they never had a tune prior and we all know by now the ls2's pcm is in fact detuned. So for an example and this is all made up but I have seen it before. Say Bob has a catback exhaust installed and then has his car dyno'd and it makes 341/340, and then it gets tuned and picks up another 19hp and 20ft lb tq, so now its at 360/360 and they post their numbers and say I got 19rwhp and 20lb ft of torque from catback, you guys see what I'm getting at here? Thats why I want to dyno and document everything that I do, not trying to flame or rant just speculating on some posts I see about rediculous dyno numbers from certain mods. I'm almost at 3000 miles so I will find out soon enough and I will post numbers again soon.


----------



## Guest (Dec 2, 2005)

so its possible to gain a good 30-35hp with just a tune alone?


----------



## 05_HUMBLER (Jul 18, 2005)

That's what I heard. I even got with Modified Performance here in KS and I was talking to him and he said it was possible. We'll see, I'm getting an app. with him next week. I'll post my dyno sheet before and aft.


----------



## Nemisis (Nov 4, 2005)

Well, I got really dang close, but I think part of it had to do with having the new era v2 cold air kit, I won't swear to it though, but yes if other mods are done then 30rwhp could be possible. Depending on the mods I'm sure.


----------

