# Reasonably priced suspension setup



## 400goatpower (Mar 30, 2008)

Hey guys, I don't have a lot of money to put towards the goat but it desperately needs suspension modding for my taste. I don't want to spend over 1500-2000$ for a setup like pedders, even though I hear it's the best. Is there a cheaper alternative? I come from an RX-8 and the handling was unreal and I want to make the goat handle and brake a little bit better. I was thinking a set of hotchkis sway bars, slotted rotors, and stainless steal break lines. This was the typical setup on the RX-8 that people did for suspension. Maybe someone could just point me in the right direction?

Thanks


----------



## 400goatpower (Mar 30, 2008)

22 views... no one?


----------



## BastropGTO (Mar 27, 2007)

I am also in your position, wanting rotors and sway bars. I have only heard good things about Hotchkis kit for our vehicles, and at 390.95 for front and back it seems to be a good deal. My next paycheck will bring those to me. As for rotors, I am planning to ebay (very carefully) for them. 
Being a college student, it would take 4 months for me to raise enough spare money for the pedders setup, so i decided to get the sway first, and save over winter and get pedders next summer.
Keep updating on what you decide, so I will have a lead to follow.

PS - Ive looked at the install instructions for Hotchkis, and am positive that it is simple.


----------



## silversport (Mar 23, 2007)

what are the slotted rotors going to give you...I know there is a lot of hype for these and there are some real world advantages too perhaps but the stockers are pretty decent although do not feel like the stockers on my '01 C5 which are outstanding IMO out in the world (not racing or rallying)...many times the rotors "look" better but in fact can be weakened by slotting or drilling...as for suspension...I have used Hotchkis once before...on an '02 Avalanche and really enjoyed them but I have no feedback other than that for our GTO applications...TTT
Bill


----------



## 400goatpower (Mar 30, 2008)

I guess the rotors wouldn't do much. I was just looking at a cheap alternative to a BBK that would improve the braking and brake pedal feel.

I've pretty much decided to jump on the hotchkis sways. 

>>>Does anyone have a recommendation to the preferred street setting for the stiffness of the front and rear bars? <<< The front bar can be set 3 ways to, 37, 49, and 63 percent. The rear, 50, 76, 111 and 156

hpautoworks sells them for 350. This is the best price I've found and is a good deal cheaper than ordered straight from the manufacturer.


----------



## BastropGTO (Mar 27, 2007)

I was looking into the rotors mostly because I believe one of mine to be slightly warped. As far as sway settings, I've heard setting front to softest and rear to best feel for you (guess and check method) on many threads. I'm torn now between C6 replica wheels or Hotch kit first. When I got my tires mounted/bal/align the idiot tried to impact wrench my lug covers off, and broke 3 (not 1) before he remembered that I told him they pull off. Good luck with your purchase!


----------



## 400goatpower (Mar 30, 2008)

oh man that sucks. I just had my rear tires changed and the guy forgot to put the caps back on. Luckily he had some intelligence and realized that they were just caps and not actual lugs. haha, fortunatly for me it took 2 seconds and he popped them back on.


----------



## Vbp6us (May 6, 2008)

400goatpower said:


> oh man that sucks. I just had my rear tires changed and the guy forgot to put the caps back on. Luckily he had some intelligence and realized that they were just caps and not actual lugs. haha, fortunatly for me it took 2 seconds and he popped them back on.


Scary thought.


----------



## koman (Sep 25, 2006)

as far as braking goes, i went with dba 4000's in the front. so far they are doing far better than the stockers. stopping distances have improved somewhat and the overall feel is better. i am using a cheap ceramic pad for the moment and haven't had too many issues so far with that.


----------



## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

peddlers is "the best" because they say it is. there is actually little difference in poly bushings and others make springs that are as good but cheaper. they make some nice shocks and struts but as their other stuff it's marked up pretty good. for bushings get the Energy Suspension master kit and fill in the missing ones (like the front radius rod) with Lovells. Lovells also makes some nice springs, strut mounts and bearings at a reasonable cost. i got Koni yellows (adjustables) from Tire Rack for a nice price. if you start with the bushings and springs and do the work yourself (not technically hard but a bit of a chore) you can do it for about $600. it will make quite a bit of difference in your car. if you go the whole route and do the shocks, struts and sway bars you'll add another $900 but be driving a whole different car and will have done a lot more than a comparable peddlers $1,500 super-duper-street-what-ever II package.


----------



## cncmasterofor (Jan 19, 2008)

IMO Hotchkis sways are a great starting point. The best bang for the buck. My settings are on the slightly stiffer side. But that where my car likes it.
As for the rest. I mixed and matched them. Pedders springs, strut/mounts with and bearings. And Noltec bushings all around. It's all about who ever has the best deal at the time. Now there are a few others out their like Koller and Lovells. Which I believe are the same as Noltec.


----------



## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

cncmasterofor said:


> IMO Hotchkis sways are a great starting point. The best bang for the buck. My settings are on the slightly stiffer side. But that where my car likes it.
> As for the rest. I mixed and matched them. Pedders springs, strut/mounts with and bearings. And Noltec bushings all around. It's all about who ever has the best deal at the time. Now there are a few others out their like *Koller and Lovells.* Which I believe are the same as Noltec.


Koller Racing is the Lovells distributor. you can save on any part that Lovells makes over Pedders plus some parts like their strut mounts are superior being poly instead of rubber without any difference in NVH. Lovells bushes are the same as Noltec but their springs are their own. the Lovells bush from Koller Racing is usually cheaper than Noltec tho.


----------



## The intimidator (Sep 24, 2008)

400goatpower said:


> Hey guys, I don't have a lot of money to put towards the goat but it desperately needs suspension modding for my taste. I don't want to spend over 1500-2000$ for a setup like pedders, even though I hear it's the best. Is there a cheaper alternative? I come from an RX-8 and the handling was unreal and I want to make the goat handle and brake a little bit better. I was thinking a set of hotchkis sway bars, slotted rotors, and stainless steal break lines. This was the typical setup on the RX-8 that people did for suspension. Maybe someone could just point me in the right direction?
> 
> Thanks


:cool Put an H&R springs kit on your car I have one it rocks!! Got mine from tirerack.com $265 to my door and I live in Hawaii!arty:


----------



## [email protected] (Jun 9, 2008)

The GTO comes with a number of weak areas and no matter what you do to it, it will not handle like an RX8. Though there are areas that you can make a good amount of improvement.

The Wretched Repair kit contains 7 of the most replaced parts on it, and will transform your GTO in to the car that it should have been from the factory.

Read More Here

I have a complete Track 2 suspension (and then some) on my car, which is every bushing, spring, damper, sway bar, links, and strut tower bar. It contains everything that you will need to make your car handle at it's highest level. 

Our parts also come with the best warranty in the business, with no exclusions for other mods, or racing.

Replacing the sway bars first is not what i'd do for a first step, as there are other more important areas that you can get more improvement from.


----------



## exwrx (Apr 5, 2007)

[email protected] said:


> The GTO comes with a number of weak areas and no matter what you do to it, it will not handle like an RX8. Though there are areas that you can make a good amount of improvement.
> 
> The Wretched Repair kit contains 7 of the most replaced parts on it, and will transform your GTO in to the car that it should have been from the factory.
> 
> ...


:agree with the sway bar comment. Adding sway bars puts tremendous strain on other areas of your suspension, and could easily cause premature failure on any number of other parts.

In regards to the hate on pedders kits..... welll they've taken the guess work out of the equation. You can't just buy any bushing kit, shocks, springs, etc... and expect it to handle well. Seat of the pants is never a good way to determine your cars handling ability. Pedders ensures that their kits seamlessly work togther to get results.

I'm not a huge fan of pedders, and am always looking for other options, but the fact that you're guaranteed improved performance... should mean something. 

It's so obvious if you think about it. You can't just go out, buy any header, intake, cam, and tune and expect to get good results. A poorly picked/misapplied cam, header or intake might even net you less area under curve than you have now.

Let's face it! Who can honestly say that their package outperforms the pedders kit on instrumented tests? I'm not saying it's impossible, but I'd love to hear the alternatives.


----------



## exwrx (Apr 5, 2007)

On this note... the track II package you list, contains a new strut bar. Any particular benefit that was measureable? Was it needed? Is it possible to order/install the Track II without the new strut bar? Any price difference?

Just a curiousity, as there are a number of such bars on the market, and I've rarely seen improvements over the OEM one that were measureable. Other than "bling" or weight savings.... what benefit would YOU say there is in replacing it?


----------



## [email protected] (Jun 9, 2008)

The Track 2 kit that i have listed is priced with out the strut tower bar, if you want to add that you can on the order page.

The GTO Strut tower bar is an improvement over the stock unit, and it also adds adjustability because you can set it to have a bit of positive or negative tension. 

The Sway bars make a big difference, there are a few brands out that do now make a big difference, but ours most definitely do.You gain adjustability of both the front and the rear bar, which is important to setting up the car. I had the Track 2 on my GTO with out the bars, and was very happy with the car, i then added the bars to the mix and it gave it the extra stiffness i was looking for.


----------



## exwrx (Apr 5, 2007)

I find it interesting that though options have been presented, no tests/timeslips have made it onto the page showing/proving a better setup than pedders.

I challenge all of you to prove me wrong, as I hope you will, since I, like everyone else, don't enjoy spending $2K on a suspension setup. Especially one that isn't adjustable. I have ridden/driven the Track II and Street II and was very impressed by both. I couldn't tell much of a difference between them as I wasn't able to really push, or wring out either vehicle.

It hurts me every time I look at parts for this car. I came from the import world, where basic coilover systems from TEIN are $800. New pads and rotors being less than $350 all around. It sucks that parts are so damn expensive for this car. Even performance pieces are much more expensive than they were for imports.... or at least Japanese Imports.

Now... the fact that i can get OEM replacement parts such as oil filters, etc... at Autozone is just priceless. lol. 

Back to the topic at hand though, the Lovells shocks that were mentioned previously.... how much are we talking for a comparable setup? Let's say I get the Lovells shocks, Noltec bushings, etc... what results are expected?


----------



## svede1212 (Nov 1, 2005)

exwrx said:


> I find it interesting that though options have been presented, no tests/timeslips have made it onto the page showing/proving a better setup than pedders.
> 
> I challenge all of you to prove me wrong, as I hope you will, since I, like everyone else, don't enjoy spending $2K on a suspension setup. Especially one that isn't adjustable. I have ridden/driven the Track II and Street II and was very impressed by both. I couldn't tell much of a difference between them as I wasn't able to really push, or wring out either vehicle.
> 
> ...


are you looking to wring every 1/100th sec track time out of it? any concern about street manners? Kings make some great springs for the track that aren't that fun to drive on the street. i would argue that mixing a control arm bushing of one brand with a subframe bushing of another with a strut mount of a third isn't going to be a problem. my Lovells springs with Koni adjustable struts and shocks work very well in a variety of conditions. i have Hotchkis, Koni, Lovells, Pedders, Energy Suspension and Super Pro parts. anybody that drove it i believe would be impressed with it's handling. another thing to consider is you can have the best of the best of all that stuff and without the very, very best tires you are leaving a lot on the table. you have to find the balance of price, performance and driving needs that fit you.


----------



## exwrx (Apr 5, 2007)

Svede... I agree completely.

The 3 most important peformance upgrades to any track car, and secrets to shaving times are....

1. Driver
2. Tires
3. Brakes

the rest is ambiguous and debateable ad infinitum. I'm glad you have a setup that works, what I was pointing out was that Pedders had simply taken all the research out of it. The Track II Rides great on streets, as does the street II, and still significantly improve the ability of this car to perform on the track.

There are a slew of other parts out there, sooo, I don't doubt some combo netting a slight edge in price and performance. But what are they? Because unless you do some pre-post testing, how do we know that a stiffer ride, means a better handling one? lol.


----------



## dms (Jun 27, 2005)

Pedders has done more R&D into the GTO and its products than all the other bush companies combined. They also offer the best support to the GTO community in the business. How many times do you see a rep from Koni, Energy, etc on any of the forums?

Many times you do get what you pay for. Coil springs, are not made equal. I have a set of blue coils that were removed for major ride quality issues, and have a bunch of comparision pictures that I will present some time when it is correct to do so.

the bottom line, however, on the GTO, is that the suspension system has multiple serious flaws and if you play hard, you will find this out very rapidly. Coils collapse, dampers are weak and poor quality, bushings collapse, and tear, and allow too much movement.

Take a peak at your OEM left rear inner control arm bushing next time you have the vehicle in the air. 90% of these OEM bushes have the center bolt forward of center. The rear inner bushings have more voids, than rubber, and are a major contributor to tire wear and wheel hop. 

the GTO suspension design came form Opel in Germany, and is basically a 15 year old or so design. Holden took this design that was primarily made for much smaller vehicles, and adapted it to a heavy platform. 

the good thing is there are lots of parts out there to fix it. The bad part, and sad part is that you do have to use these parts to fix it. OEM stuff is seriously inferior

mike
dms


----------

