# Another header inquiry



## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Hello all. I know this has been discussed to death by my question is a little more specific. Considering headers for 1970 GTO RA IV with 4 sp. Looking at the specs of the Hedman header with a 1 3/4 tube and 3 inch collector would it not seem to be a little less space requiring than the Doug's 1 7/8 tube and 3 1/2 inch collector? The Dougs are frequently mentioned but the Hedmans not so much. Is my rational valid or are the differences inconsequential? Your thoughts please


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## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

My car is a 67 with Dougs. Zero issues, oil changes are a breeze, too. From my perspective, tube size means nothing, route thought is what makes or breaks the deal. 

Everyone loves the Dougs because they fit so well.


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## Old Man Taylor (May 9, 2011)

Doug's for sure.


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Old Man Taylor said:


> Doug's for sure.





Old Man Taylor said:


> Doug's for sure.





Old Man Taylor said:


> Doug's for sure.





Old Man Taylor said:


> Doug's for sure.





armyadarkness said:


> My car is a 67 with Dougs. Zero issues, oil changes are a breeze, too. From my perspective, tube size means nothing, route thought is what makes or breaks the deal.
> 
> Everyone loves the Dougs because they fit so well.


Thanks much. all. This site always best for definitive answers


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

I'm running Doug's on my 69, with Edelbrock round port heads so I'm using the exact same headers you'd need for your car with the RA IV. They fit "pretty well".
Issues:

The passenger side tubes run directly under the oil filter so I can't run the "full length" filter.
I also had to make a sheet metal shield with some lips at the edges that I put over those tubes and under the filter before I remove it for an oil change, otherwise when I remove the filter it dumps a bunch of oil on top of and between the tubes.
I had to 'reverse' one of the lower control arm bolts on the passenger side so that the bolt head is next to the header tube. Otherwise the nut end of the bolt sticks out far enough to rub on the tube and would probably wear a hole in it pretty quickly. This means when I service the lower control arm on the passenger side, I'll have to loosen that header before I'll be able to get that bolt out.
Back drive linkage for the steering wheel lock mechanism: I had to completely re-bend/reshape the linkage rod in order to keep that system functional and clear the driver side header.
Brake line distribution block on the inside of the driver side frame rail had to be moved to the top of the frame rail. Otherwise it would have been less than 1/16" away from a hot header and probably would have cooked my brake fluid.
I recommend replacing at least 2 bolts on each side with studs and nuts. This makes it a ton easier to get all the fasteners installed because you can 'hang' the header on the studs during installation so you don't have to try to hold it up AND start a bolt into a hole that you can't see and can barely touch.
None of the header manufacturer coatings are all that great. I recommend buying them in bare steel and having them shipped out to the nearest JetHot coatings facility and have them apply some of their "Ultra Extreme Heat 2500" coating. The stuff is great. The finish is like 60 grit sandpaper and is tough as nails. I had mine done in a blue that looks really good next to the Pontiac Silver Blue Metallic engine color. 

Bear


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

BearGFR said:


> I'm running Doug's on my 69, with Edelbrock round port heads so I'm using the exact same headers you'd need for your car with the RA IV. They fit "pretty well".
> Issues:
> 
> The passenger side tubes run directly under the oil filter so I can't run the "full length" filter.
> ...


Thanks Bear, Advice taken. Funny thing in 1970 I had hooker headers installed on this car by a speed shop ( pretty common back in the day) . I do not think all these issues arose back then . My only complaint was that they greatly reduced ground clearance. Any good reason not to go to a remote filter mount?


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Captainfish#1 said:


> Thanks Bear, Advice taken. Funny thing in 1970 I had hooker headers installed on this car by a speed shop ( pretty common back in the day) . I do not think all these issues arose back then . My only complaint was that they greatly reduced ground clearance. Any good reason not to go to a remote filter mount? It is good to hear however that no tube dimpling was required. My car has the 1/4 inch spacer plates behind frame brackets. Would you expect that to have an impact on fitment? Thanks,Paul


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## Old Man Taylor (May 9, 2011)

I've always run shorty filters on any engine with headers. And make sure you have the GTO filter adapter housing - it angles in towards the block.

I never found that putting any studs in helped. I slot the flange behind the #5 and #6 ports so I can put the bolt in first, and then pull the header onto it. A couple of bolts are a real problem. I use bolts with 5/16" heads on those. 

When I change oil, I use a section of old inner tube to guide the oil leaks into the pan. It's a pain to get oil onto the header tubes. Sometimes it's actually easier to remove the complete filter adapter housing with the filter still attached. 

The brake distribution block has to be moved even if you use RA manifolds.


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Old Man Taylor said:


> I've always run shorty filters on any engine with headers. And make sure you have the GTO filter adapter housing - it angles in towards the block.
> 
> I never found that putting any studs in helped. I slot the flange behind the #5 and #6 ports so I can put the bolt in first, and then pull the header onto it. A couple of bolts are a real problem. I use bolts with 5/16" heads on those.
> 
> ...


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Thanks OMT, Since my car was born with RA manifolds I assume the distribution block ( still 4 wheel manual drum ) is in a decent location now. I too use the shorty filters and changing the filters on any of these things on your back on your garage floor is never a pristine procedure. Thanks all. Learned alot


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## coyote595 (Dec 4, 2019)

Please let us know where your distribution block is located on your car. Would be interesting to see if the factory put it in a different location with the RA manifolds.


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## Captainfish#1 (Dec 31, 2017)

Sure Coyote595, It is 3' in front of the backlock rod. It is parallel to frame about 1/4 inch off the frame and is up 2" from the bottom of the frame. Hope this helps.


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## armyadarkness (Dec 7, 2020)

For whatever it's worth, I have the Dougs and use full length filters. And with all new, OEM (not dropped) suspension, I can easily change my oil, without even jacking up the car.


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