# 1968 gto timing issue????



## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

Hello All: It's bob again:
I would like to know why my GTO runs so great at 22 degrees BTDC. Intial Timing. Idle rpm's 700
1. Total Timing kicks in at 2800 rpms at 34 degrees ????
2. I have a MSD electronic system. 6AL model.
3. Stock Distrubutor with just a rotor and magnictic pickup.
4. Engine 400cu with Hooker Header's and Elderbrock manifold.
5. Elderbrock carburator model 1460 600cfm
6. No cam
7. Runs like shit at 14 degrees BTDC.
8. Runs better at 18 degrees BTDC 
9. Runs much better at 20 degress BTDC
10. Runs like a Jet at 22 degrees BTDC
11. Engine sounds so smooth and Idel's great.
12. Start's right up when Hot. Engine running much cooler.
13. I just don't understand???? I believe I should not be at 22 degress at base timing??????? No pinging at all. Engine rmp's at 4000. No pinging???
What's with this engine?????
Curious minds would like to know???
Have a great day, Bob


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## Shake-N-Bake (Jun 16, 2015)

Have you verified the timing mark is accurate and actually represents TDC? Have you tried another timing light to make sure the readings are the same? My neighbor had a Harbor Freight timing light with adjustable dial. The sticker with the increments came loose and gave false readings so you can't always trust the readings. There have been multiple times in the past where I had to set timing bu ear because the balancer mark was not correct....mostly on small block Chevy engines...

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## My65goat (Jul 26, 2017)

Did you Un hook the vac advance? 22 degrees sounds about right when the vacuum advance is hooked up. And that would be about 12 degrees without vac advance. And as far as the 34 total that is also about perfect. Now keep in mind that the vacuum goes away under throttle, so all numbers you mentioned sound good if you had your vac advance hooked up.


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

Hello My65Goat:
I got no vaccum advance. MSD Ignition system. No vaccum line going to the Distrubutor. Just Distrubutor cap. Read my post closely....
Got me... Timing Light OK.... Got new Balancer, but could it be off??????? Will ask #3 mechanic about that. It seems to run like it did before, before the new timing cover with the new balancer????? Dame engine is running like a F16 Jet.... LOL I will talk to my #3 mechanic about this. I'll have him work my Timing light. It's a high end one with all the toy's on it...... I just got a Devil Engine.... Kick's ass right now. Up's and goes in 3rd gear at 70 mph. Right up to 100mph.... No pinging?????? It's MAGIC.... LOL I have a HT400 Trans.
Anyone out there got any Idea's why this engine runs great at 22 degress at Base timing???? 
Bob


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## cij911 (Oct 25, 2017)

Beast - Cams ?? Cam timing / degreed ?

With regards to timing, you already answered your question - you have no vacuum advance and total timing is 34* which is pretty much what most say is about right. So as MyGoat65 said, you are right where you should be ~22* at idle & 34* total timing by 2800. (Congrats!)

You may want to read Lars' How to Set Timing document.....

So in summary, you don't have an anomaly and you are running the standard timing.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Forget factory specs when you've made changes to other things - they're meaningless. Don't let the specs play mind games with you and make you feel like you must be "wrong" because your car is different.

You're doing fine. First order of business is to find out how much total at WOT your engine likes, and at 34 degrees it sounds like you're probably right on the money. Most engines usually LIKE a lot of advance at idle no-load conditions, but as they move off of idle and start to see some load, not as much. That's one of the functions of the vacuum advance mechanism that a lot of people don't realize. At idle/no load your engine is making lots of vacuum so the diaphragm is adding a lot of advance. However, as soon as you add throttle/load and vacuum starts to drop, it has the effect of actually pulling advance OUT of the engine which is exactly what needs to happen under those conditions in order to stay out of detonation. Then as RPM increases, the mechanical advance starts to add it back in. 

As long as it's not hard to start, doesn't overheat, runs like a healthy Pontiac should, and doesn't ping/rattle under load - you're fine. Don't sweat it.

Bear


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## Goat Roper (Oct 28, 2014)

I'm confused, is the 68 engine in the 2004-2006 GTO or vice versa?


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

Hello Goat Roper: The 1968 GTO has a 1968 engine. 400cu. 
Read the spec. in first post... I think I posted in wrong area...
Thank you all for the input.
I'm a proud owner of one wild running Jet Engine 1968 GTO. She is screaming.
I don't think I should go any higher than 22 degrees at bast timing. My engine is so smooth at Idel you can put a glass of water on the air cleaner and not spill a drop.... My #3 mechanic saw it today and we checked out my timing light. Everything OK.... I'm going to run the 1/4 mile at 8 sec. at 170 mph. LOL LOL
You all have a great week. Tks
Bobby


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

BearGFR said:


> Forget factory specs when you've made changes to other things - they're meaningless. Don't let the specs play mind games with you and make you feel like you must be "wrong" because your car is different.
> 
> You're doing fine. First order of business is to find out how much total at WOT your engine likes, and at 34 degrees it sounds like you're probably right on the money. Most engines usually LIKE a lot of advance at idle no-load conditions, but as they move off of idle and start to see some load, not as much. That's one of the functions of the vacuum advance mechanism that a lot of people don't realize. At idle/no load your engine is making lots of vacuum so the diaphragm is adding a lot of advance. However, as soon as you add throttle/load and vacuum starts to drop, it has the effect of actually pulling advance OUT of the engine which is exactly what needs to happen under those conditions in order to stay out of detonation. Then as RPM increases, the mechanical advance starts to add it back in.
> 
> ...


This^^^. I secretly think you are less than a true 22 initial, due to markings, parts, etc. I can tell you, my GTO's would not crank over with that much advance unless the spark was disabled. Waaaay too much, if accurate. You should run a vacuum advance, though, for better power, better economy, and lower engine temperatures. Win-win-win.


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

To: GeeTeeohguy

I just got this car running great, and you want me to set it up with a Vaccumm Advance system. Why do so many people like the MSD ignition system.

Your car is a different animal than mine so I'm assuming the timing would be different. Like everyone says let your engine tell you when she is happy. I will double check now the Balancer to top dead center. Timing light is ok. I got new everything on the car. Don't those MSD ignition system kind of help the timing???????? Have a great day,
Bobby


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## Dave Ray (May 18, 2018)

Racing only distributor in a street engine, common issue, NO vacuum advance to help idle quality. Now, if 14 were used as an initial timing, AND, a CORRECTLY SET UP VACUUM ADVANCE with 8 degrees of crankshaft timing set into it, run on full manifold vacuum, the initial would be reasonable, and the idle timing would be at the 22 it has always wanted to have, even dead stock. The nice thing is, there would be an adjustable option to add whatever degrees needed to match the 22/24 idle degrees, no matter the initial you want to use. 

Examples: 14 initial, 8 vacuum, 22 idle, 12 initial, 10 vacuum, 22 idle, and, on, and, on.

Now, just how to set up the timing stop on a vacuum advance? Two different ways, set distance and adjustable, ask for the vacuum advance pictures package, NO COST, NO ADS, just how to do it right, and inexpensively. You have NOTHING to lose by looking.

[email protected]


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## My65goat (Jul 26, 2017)

He says in his initial post that it is a stock distributor with a "msd" pick up.....that's why I thought that he didn't Un hook vacuum advance. 

If it is a stock distributor with a "msd" conversion, then it has a vacuum advance. If it doesn't have a vacuum advance then it has a hole in the side of distributor where it was......

Better ask mechanic #4 ....


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## My65goat (Jul 26, 2017)

rob40999 said:


> Hello All: It's bob again:
> I would like to know why my GTO runs so great at 22 degrees BTDC. Intial Timing. Idle rpm's 700
> 1. Total Timing kicks in at 2800 rpms at 34 degrees ????
> 2. I have a MSD electronic system. 6AL model.
> ...


 number 3. " stock distributor with just a rotor and magnetic pickup"


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

Hello Guys: You got me all confused??? Is my GTO not set up right???
Do I need a vaccum advance or not. I bought the car this way? Seems to run ok???????? I thought the Idea with a MSD ignition system was that you don't need vaccum advance or points????? I'm confused... Only thing I seem to have here in Florida when I'm at a red light for awhile and the engine get's up to 200 degrees. Gas gets hot and she kind of stumbles in 3rd gear when I give her the gas. As soon as the temp comes down to 180 degrees she runs great. I think she would like a set of colder spark plugs. I got one new big radiator in her, and that has really helped alot. I think some times you all are to technical for the average JOE..... LOL Keep up the good work. I read these posts a lot. Is 22 degress intial timing ok????? I'm back to my first question????
Thank you, Bobby


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## Dave Ray (May 18, 2018)

22 degrees is right on target, it matters HOW you get to it. OP, what pickup is in the distributor, whom did it? 

And, ANY stock GM point distributor can be set up with no vacuum advance, not hard to do. I delete the VA on EFI-HEI units I convert, no issues, as they are also locked out on the mechanical advance as well, for the EFI computer to set the timing.

We do not know much about this engine, need more info to properly advise, like how many degrees of cam duration, compression ratio, more.

READ "6. No cam", at that 18 deg/BTDC initial, it should be fairly unhappy starting, especially hot. It sounds like it isn't. 

If the engine is cast iron block and heads, 180 deg/F is just right. There are a lot of other things that can make the temps rise under certain conditions, fan, shroud, pulley ratio, thermostat, and in a Pontiac, the restrictors/diverters at the water pump, and more. Simply hanging a giant radiator on an engine may well not work as it should if other things are not right.


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## My65goat (Jul 26, 2017)

I'm not trying to confuse you Bob. I just don't think that it is 22 degrees. And I'm not the only one. 
Now, you say stock distributor with rotor and magnetic pick up, that's what leads me to believe that it is 22 degrees with vacuum advance, which is pretty good. And 34 total is also pretty good. 

Here's the bottom line.....If it's running great and starting great....then it's great, but as others have said vacuum advance is good for a street car.

200° is fine, 180 at cruise is even better. I wouldn't touch a thing. Drive it and enjoy it.


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

Hello Dave and MyGoat: As to Dave question about the radiator. I left out that it also has a 7 blade flex fan, high end water pump, and shroud. Just did my Sunday mourning 110 mile ride, and she ran at 170 degrees on the highway at 60 mph. Also I put in her a 160 degree termostate. Radiator is rated for 700hp. To all that read this. When I bought the car it ran very Hot here in Florida would get up to 230 degrees just sitting at a red light. Then run hot moving at 40 mph. Run around 200 degrees all the time or more. I did not like that. So what I put in the car really, really stopped the heating problem I drive the car everyday to the golf course, and never get over 190 degrees at a long stop light anymore. 

I like MyGoat answer that if it's running and not getting Hot, and start's right up. It is fine. Please understand I do NOT have a Vaccum advance. Just the Distrubutor, rotor, and the magnitic pick up in the Distrubutor. All this run by a MSD model 6AL box. what ever you call it. Blaster 2 coil. 8mm spark plug wires. R43S plugs. Would like to find some colder plugs. Car ran so strong this mourning running at 170 degrees.... It just loves the highway. Open up the 4 barrell and right up to 90 to 100mph... I get scared at 100 mph. With this 50 year old car afraid the front windsheild will fly off. LOL LOL I'm going to leave it at 22 degrees base timing. Been at that setting now for 500 miles... Engine didn't blow up. Engine is stock 400cu,stock cam, and just headers, and a high rise manifold, with a simple Elderbrock 600cfm carburator. With one big F%^$ Radiator. LOL LOL You all have a great week. Also Thank you for the help...
Bobby


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## Dave Ray (May 18, 2018)

The reason for the engine wanting to run 180 deg/F is combustion chamber temperature efficiency. If that same engine had aluminum heads, to keep the same efficiency, I would go for a 192 to 195 deg/F thermostat. Sounds like the cooling system is working well. If you are not aware4 of this as of yet about Pontiac engines, they use a setup at the water pump that other engines do not use, inserts to direct and control flow behind the water pump. If left out, worn out, heating issues can easily ensue. 

The ONLY reason to run any engine hotter than their old skool efficiency is if the design has evolved into a full-on emissions setup, that needs higher chamber temps to help burn off more fuel residues. 

I am well aware you have no vacuum advance, it was removed from the stock distributor. If it runs as you like nopw, keep it as is. I think it could run even better, with a correctly set up vacuum advance enhanced distributor.


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## Goat Roper (Oct 28, 2014)

rob40999 said:


> Hello All: It's bob again:
> I would like to know why my GTO runs so great at 22 degrees BTDC. Intial Timing. Idle rpm's 700
> 1. Total Timing kicks in at 2800 rpms at 34 degrees ????
> 2. I have a MSD electronic system. 6AL model.
> ...


I would replace the 25% CFM you lost with a 800 CFM carb.
My engine seems to like the 195 thermostat and runs best at this temp.
Stock size radiator and clearance done on the plates.
If I run it hard it goes up to 205 but cools quickly once I let off.
Normal running temp is 190.


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

Hello Goat, and Dave: Like to know where you two guys live. I don't think either of you live here in Florida. The weather here this summer has hit 100 degrees easy.
Humidity off the carts. Very hot out side for these old engines. I had a new timing cover put on with a high flow water pump, and I know about the spacer was put it correctly. Bought the system from Butler Eng. I only buy the best for the car. As far as a bigger carb. sounds good, but I'm 66 years old, and it looks just like it came off the assembly line. Mint. I really baby this car except when I clean her out for my Sunday rides. The engine is the stock engine. Cast Iron heads, and all stock in side. I had the mechanic #3 check compression, and all is ok. I pulled the spark plugs just to see how they were burning the fuel. All still looked good after 1500 miles with a light brown color. No build up so I believe no oil is leaking by the rings, and the new carburator is working great. We did put a spacer between the carb and the manifold to help with the heat down here in Florida. I'm surprise we didn't have any other member's on this site sign in and say. Yes, Florida is very HOT. LOL LOL Any other information you got I surely would love. Have a safe ride, and a great week. Bobby


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## Goat Roper (Oct 28, 2014)

I am in Lake Arrowhead So Cal so 116 in Mojave and San Ber'dino.
But it's a dry heat.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

rob40999 said:


> Hello Dave and MyGoat: As to Dave question about the radiator. I left out that it also has a 7 blade flex fan, high end water pump, and shroud. Just did my Sunday mourning 110 mile ride, and she ran at 170 degrees on the highway at 60 mph. Also I put in her a 160 degree termostate. Radiator is rated for 700hp. To all that read this. When I bought the car it ran very Hot here in Florida would get up to 230 degrees just sitting at a red light. Then run hot moving at 40 mph. Run around 200 degrees all the time or more. I did not like that. So what I put in the car really, really stopped the heating problem I drive the car everyday to the golf course, and never get over 190 degrees at a long stop light anymore.
> 
> I like MyGoat answer that if it's running and not getting Hot, and start's right up. It is fine. Please understand I do NOT have a Vaccum advance. Just the Distrubutor, rotor, and the magnitic pick up in the Distrubutor. All this run by a MSD model 6AL box. what ever you call it. Blaster 2 coil. 8mm spark plug wires. R43S plugs. Would like to find some colder plugs. Car ran so strong this mourning running at 170 degrees.... It just loves the highway. Open up the 4 barrell and right up to 90 to 100mph... I get scared at 100 mph. With this 50 year old car afraid the front windsheild will fly off. LOL LOL I'm going to leave it at 22 degrees base timing. Been at that setting now for 500 miles... Engine didn't blow up. Engine is stock 400cu,stock cam, and just headers, and a high rise manifold, with a simple Elderbrock 600cfm carburator. With one big F%^$ Radiator. LOL LOL You all have a great week. Also Thank you for the help...
> Bobby


You should be good with the way it is set up. The cooler running water temps lowers the probability of detonation/pinging - so that seems covered.

One of the performance changes Royal Pontiac did and included in their Bobcat treatment was to eliminate the vacuum advance by disconnecting the hose to the distributor and plugging it. The initial timing at the balancer was then advanced to between 16 and 20 degrees depending on compression and type of fuel used. The distributor advance/weights was set to provide 6-8 distributor degrees which is equal to 12-16 crank degrees at the balancer. Their total advance, initial + distributor was held to 36 degrees - BUT this is when you could get the Sunoco 270 leaded octane gas. Even they make note that on a hot day the total is brought back to 34 degrees total.

So the car seems fine as set-up and you do not need a vacuum advance. My personal opinion here is to keep total advance around 32 - 34 degrees as long as no detonation/pinging results. Most the old style dual point distributors did not have vacuum advance as cars used for high performance use or racing did not need them. The vacuum advance does however provide an increase in gas mileage and can help in cooling engine temps under when engine vacuum is highest and your foot is off the gas. Seeing you probably don't put a lot of miles on it, gas mileage isn't a concern and your cooling seems to be pretty good for you.

The MSD box is the way to go and can be used with either points or electronic ignitions. MSD stands for Multiple Spark Discharge. It was the first multiple spark system using capacitive discharge. MSD provide a hotter spark and as the name implies, provides multiple sparks from idle up to 3,000 RPM's. It will fire a spark across a wider gap where others will not. Each spark an MSD ignition produces is an extremely high current spark. This is because MSD uses Capacitive discharge technology to produce a very high primary voltage. These high powered sparks ensure complete combustion of the fuel mixture at everything from idle to high racing RPM, producing more power. Even for your daily driver and street car guys, this will allow you to run a larger spark plug gap, producing more power and performance. 

The MSD 6AL has the added benefit of a rev limiter which can be set through the use of specific RPM modules to match your engine - it'll save your engine should you miss a shift, do a smokey burn-out that jumps past the designed revs of the engine, or simply slip your tires on ice/snow/wet roads. I have used the MSD6 in the past with a points distributor with great results and noticed an immediate difference in engine idle. I have the MSD6AL for use in my 455 build because of its built-in rev limiter.

Check out this video that will show you the benefits of a multiple spark 



 and then check out this video which shows the MSD's higher voltage jumping a gap that conventional ignitions would not: 




MSD received honors as the SEMA manufacturer of the year in both 2005 and 2007 and Hot Rod Magazine named MSD's 6A ignition box into its second class of the Speed Parts Hall of Fame in 2009 in recognition of how the company has helped to shape the American racing industry.

Here is one of my favorite comparisons by Car Craft magazine - Points vs HEI. It may be my bias, but the points seem to out perform the HEI when it is all said and done. Would have been an even better comparison if each type distributor had used an MSD box - maybe the tables would have been turned around. https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ccrp-9812-ignition-performance-test/


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## rob40999 (May 18, 2018)

*1968 engine timing issues*

Hello Goat and Jim: Like to say first to Goat. God bless you living in CA. It's hot in CA. Dry heat or not. I forgot to tell you all my GTO has no A/C. :-(
LOL LOL Ride with all the windows open. I just love the vent windows. Good luck Goat... Stay Cool.... LOL

Hello Jim: You have always given me such great detailed advice. I just loved the vedio of the MSD product. I did set my MSD 6AL rev limiter to 5,000 rpm's. I have yet gotten to 5,000 rpm's. I only have had her up to around 4,500 rpm's. I'm not a speed deemin. Just clean out the plugs on my very early Sunday mourning's ride. Must leave the house at 0730 hours to beat the noon heat. LOL You guy's have probably changed your cars a lot. Rebuilt engines. New ignition system's, and so on. I want to leave my garage, and go for a ride, and not have a brake down. If I can figure out how to work this computer I'll post some pictures of the car and me. I'm no where near the mechanic you all are or even computer smart. I get the neighbor 12 year old to come over and help me. LOL LOL Again Thank you all for the info. From Goat, Jim, Dave and a few more: Thank you, Bobby  I'll be back... LOL LOL


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## cij911 (Oct 25, 2017)

PJ : I believe the 6AL provides the amplified spark up to 15,000 RPM. If only 3,000 RPM, then it would not provide that much benefit IMHO (other than around town, casual driving).


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

Actual side by side by side dyno test: Stock points vs stock HEI vs DUI HEI

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ccrp-9812-ignition-performance-test/

Another side by side test: Stock HEI vs DUI HEI

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ctrp-0708-distributor-dyno-test/

Something I've been searching for but curiously, so far unable to find is a side by side dyno test with an MSD or a similar system and "anything else". There are lots of examples out there that show an MSD system firing a massive spark _outside the engine_ on some sort of testing station and they're quite impressive. The all show a huge fat spark that can persist and be near perfect all the way up to 10,000 rpm. I'm reminded of all those "snake oil" presentations that we used to see at county fairs on the midway, where a guy would perform similar out-of-engine demos using some mysterious red part that he'd plug in to the top of the distributor between the distributor cap and the coil wire They were impressive demos. However, what is it that we really care about for making power in an engine? Is the end goal having a big fat spark or is it getting an efficient and thorough fuel burn? Do these units actually do a better job of burning fuel or do they just "look good" on the demo stand? I have no idea myself, I'm just asking the question. In the absence of any real side by side testing _in a running engine on the dyno_ we're just going to have to keep guessing (and arguing). 

The first set of actual dyno tests from above say that for normal street RPM - 7000 and below in the case of that test - neither HEI has a significant advantage in terms of power production over a points system in good working order. The second set of test results show that the DUI has a tiny tiny miniscule advantage over a stock HEI, but not much. The numbers don't lie. 

For a reasonably streetable Pontiac that's going to spend most if not all of its life below 6000 RPM, there's no performance advantage in running an HEI over a points system. I'm still looking for "proof" about MSD.

Bear


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## Dave Ray (May 18, 2018)

ANY CD system gives sufficient voltages at higher rpm's, ALL MotoGP Grands Prix motorcycle engines have rev limited engines and run to 18,800 rpm's regularly with their CD systems. What stops at 3K in an MSD is the multi spark feature, because charge time is reduced to only allowing ONE charge per cylinder event. No question charging a separate capacitor, and not the coil, makes for more reliable spark energy, the coil doesn't have to charge, it is "cold" until the capacitor forces it to make the highest voltages, every spark. 

the MSD Speed Shop display shown is a good one, and, not many people realized it was also a test bench for MSD products back then, I have three of them. One of mine is also connected to digital read scopes and devices. Do I prefer an MSD, YES, their CD boxes re top notch, always have been, RtR, coils, bottom of the barrel since their involvement in moving various productions to other part of the world. Anyone remember the stand alone distributor MSD had BEFORE the Ready to Quit" I DO. I worked on enough of them to know. 

Jim says that removing the vacuum advance is a performance gain, well, yes, for a full race competition engine, but not a sensible street engine. Dyno hero's that have NO common sense in street engine setup, demand that the vacuum advance get ripped off the distributor, and then, timing gets shot to the moon. Well, YUP, that IS what both "race tuners" and those that refuse to realize that dyno's are NOT a final tuning device do, ill advise.

And, as Jim stated in one topic some place on this board about a Crane adjustable vacuum advance, and why that way ISN'T the right way to do it, as he has no comprehension of how it works, his words, not mine. Tell us all, Jim, just how the degrees are stopped down on an adjustable vacuum advance, correctly. 

As far as weather and location, formerly Los Angeles, the last 14 years, 80 miles south-east of Reno, Nevada, 4,400 feet altitude, Mason Valley, winter, -10, rain and snow, summer, 110 degrees, so, please don't tell me I do not know about weather changes, altitudes, and other "tuning issues".

Now, to the OP, drive it, enjoy it, it is running, no problem, but, please, do not do a PontiacJim and try to convince others I do not know exactly what I am doing with engines, carburetors, EFI, and especially ignition systems.


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## PontiacJim (Dec 29, 2012)

And with that to close the conversation.......


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## Goat Roper (Oct 28, 2014)

Magnetic or opto?


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## Lemans guy (Oct 14, 2014)

On ‘ 1960’s gasoline these engines should run at 52 to 54 degrees,...at light throttle cruise. On today’s gas which all even pure gas that is reformulated,..the cars should run at 46 to 48 degrees at light throttle cruise. That is because the throttle is barely open and the mixture is leaner and needs that spark ahead to burn efficiently.....and ......cooler.

The only way to achieve this is with a computerized distributor or ...vacumn advance. Having an MSD module in an original distributor is not a computer.....the msd module is just a magnetic switch that replaces the points, a mechanical switch. It has nothing to do with timing.

MSD and other have computerized distributors, does not sound like you have that.

You have a racers set-Up,...very common I see tons of them at the cruise ins. Must be good cause the racers, the builders use it, right?

No a racer wants to idle cool sure,....20 to 26 degrees of advance and then he wants great performance with the throttle down.....you have both. But what you lack is everything in between,....you can not cruise with 48 degrees or advance....you don’t have it, so you have to put more throttle to get that speed, it makes more heat and uses more gas. 

Now with vacumn advance when you drop the hammer the vacumn advance drops out same as a racer, you lose no top end. And at idle if you use 10 degrees or so vac advance you can easily get the 22 degrees, by using a base of 12 degrees.


Your car is setup for racing really, for street performance and ideal cooling, ideal burning the mixture at all light throttle operations, for not wasting gas, and not washing down your cylinders with gas at cruise because of an overly rich mixture you need a vacumn advance.

Now that said you drive and set up your car how you want it and many do it like you. Just know their other ways and If set up with vac advance, a light pedal will give you awesome power, barely touching the throttle because the timing will be more advanced than you can get with your set up.

There is no wrong way really, so lot’s of guys drive em that way.


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