# please help me evaluate a Judge project



## original orbit (Nov 10, 2008)

I have an opportunity to buy a 1970 Orbit Orange Judge. PHS documented. PS, PB, rear defogger, not much else for options. RAIII engine. Body is painted but needs panels lined up, defects touched up and a final coat of color and clear coat. Engine is not numbers matching but is correct block, heads, carb.... pretty complete. Interior is stripped out but all there (worn prior restoration). Floors previously replaced, Engine bay is done, brakes are done, Mostly needs to be reassembled. Engine is also out and needs to be gone through. Needs rear bumper and likely some interior items. Price is $24k. 

What do you think?


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

Needing paint and interior I would think the price is a little too steep. IMO anyway.


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## Red1970GTO (Jun 25, 2011)

*70 Judge*

:cool Seems a byte high, however it's a *JUDGE*. arty:


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Sounds like it needs a full-on 30-50k restoration. Body, paint, engine, etc. 24k is too high. You'll have 54-74k in it, and you can buy a nice one already done for 40-ish.


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## BearGFR (Aug 25, 2008)

:agree I'd pass on it at that price unless you have some overriding reason to buy this particular car that makes cost/value irrelevant. But then if that was the case you probably wouldn't have asked. 

Bear


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## original orbit (Nov 10, 2008)

I may not have been clear about the paint/body. The body has been done. It only needs adjustment for body panel alignment and final top coat after some very minor touch ups. It has a new coat of paint already. Here is a pic of the body:








http://s217.photobucket.com/user/gccch/media/CaymanS/judge_zps20a59e5f.jpg.html?sort=3&o=0


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

Why does the rear quarter look a different color then the door, trunk and front end?


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

looks like thats the part that does not have the clear on it yet


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## original orbit (Nov 10, 2008)

Painted at different times. He was planning a final repaint after aligning the panels and other touch up (a little needed on rocker panels). It comes with the paint, so it's labor to align, some fill and then final coat.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

Even if it was painted at different times, it should still be the same color!
And I think it's going to take more then one coat to cover that.


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

I agree. Paint that doesn't match, is chipped, and needs a final coat means the car needs a complete repaint to look right. It looks to me that the front clip/doors were painted off the car.....that can cause the paint to lie down differently from the rest of the car. Also, many painters won't touch a car that has already been 'done', as they have no way of knowing the quality of the work that is underneath the new surface. To do it right, it needs a complete re-do, if you want more than a basic driver. And for 24k to start, plus the $$$ needed to get it up and running, you'll have show car money invested in a driver quality car. Doesn't pencil out. The car would be a better deal if it wasn't repainted at all....at least you'd know what you were getting.


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## original orbit (Nov 10, 2008)

Thanks guys. I guess I will pass. I was planning to negotiate to have the body completely done right before taking delivery but they don't even want to do that.


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## busaben (Oct 30, 2008)

paint and body work is the most expensive part of a restoration nowadays, and if its not done right, the car will never look right.


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## GTO JUDGE (May 14, 2005)

Ya know.... Many will scoff and laugh at this but for a basic show car and driver, MACCO may be a viable alternative. Not talking body work but a paint job.

A guy and his wife I know with multiple GTOs had Macco do their paint and these are fussy folks. I looked at the job Macco did and it looked very good to me and they were happy, years after the work was finished too. At a fraction of the cost of what some body shops will charge. It may be worth the while to talk to a Macco shop.

You may be surprised at the cost and quality. I am not talking a concuurs restoration but for the car show on the weekends, and cruising, it may be worthwhile checking into. Doing a job on a classic with word of mouth advertising, it may spur them going the extra mile for future business. Just a thought ........


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## Instg8ter (Sep 28, 2010)

Spraying is 10% of the overall paint job, I have seen some good and some bad from Maaco, all depends on the time and care they take doing it. for their price i find it hard to believe they can use a quality BC/CC, i went with mid grade base and premium clear and the cost of materials alone to do the car was around $800.00. BUT, these cars were originally a single stage paint and not dipped in clear like todays cars and with some sanding and buffing can look very presentable and even show quality. What it comes down to is paying someone to care about what they do. With the right equipment and a little practice even a monkey like me can do a reasonable job spraying a car, but the 200+ hrs to smooth out the body was free...


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## ALKYGTO (Mar 29, 2010)

GTO JUDGE said:


> Ya know.... Many will scoff and laugh at this but for a basic show car and driver, MACCO may be a viable alternative. Not talking body work but a paint job.
> 
> A guy and his wife I know with multiple GTOs had Macco do their paint and these are fussy folks. I looked at the job Macco did and it looked very good to me and they were happy, years after the work was finished too. At a fraction of the cost of what some body shops will charge. It may be worth the while to talk to a Macco shop.
> 
> You may be surprised at the cost and quality. I am not talking a concuurs restoration but for the car show on the weekends, and cruising, it may be worthwhile checking into. Doing a job on a classic with word of mouth advertising, it may spur them going the extra mile for future business. Just a thought ........





Instg8ter said:


> Spraying is 10% of the overall paint job, I have seen some good and some bad from Maaco, all depends on the time and care they take doing it. for their price i find it hard to believe they can use a quality BC/CC, i went with mid grade base and premium clear and the cost of materials alone to do the car was around $800.00. BUT, these cars were originally a single stage paint and not dipped in clear like todays cars and with some sanding and buffing can look very presentable and even show quality. What it comes down to is paying someone to care about what they do. With the right equipment and a little practice even a monkey like me can do a reasonable job spraying a car, but the 200+ hrs to smooth out the body was free...


Agreed, the quality of your bodywork and prep is the key. The beauty of BC/CC is the ability to fix imperfections and sand and buff out imperfections. Fact is Maaco does thousands of paint jobs and the painters are usually very thorough so it all amounts to prep and a quality taping job.


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