# SLP Bobcat 455 package



## Bebensee (Oct 17, 2006)

Does anyone have this package or know anyone that does? Was wondering if it is worth the 4 grand it costs. 

160º Thermostat (100228) 
High-Flow Air Filter (25013B) 
Harmonic Balancer/Under-drive Pulley (100226) 
Long Tube Ceramic Coated Headers w/PowerFlo-X™ Crossover/High-Flow Cats (30168) 
Loud Mouth II™ Cat-Back Exhaust System (31561) 
1.85 Rocker Arm Package (51185) 
DiabloSport II Programmer with SLP Custom Tuning (27010T) 
455 HP Bobcat Fender Badges (pair) 

all for about 3900 bucks.


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## Bebensee (Oct 17, 2006)

Thanks, must say Dizzy I have really leared a lot reading your posts on here, thanks for all the info.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

I have it with the LMII. Had it installed at the dealer and no issues with warranty - even at other dealers.


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## Bebensee (Oct 17, 2006)

Thats awesome. how much did the dealer charge you to put it on? How do you like it? Is there much gas milage differance?


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## Guest (May 27, 2007)

*Mods*



Bebensee said:


> Thanks, must say Dizzy I have really leared a lot reading your posts on here, thanks for all the info.


You do not have to spend ton's of money on your car,, your Motor is a killer in stock form,,if you just want a little more bang..go with a good Cat Back System,[ you do not need headers ] add a good Cold Air Intake, I use AEM's Brute Force
and then get a good dyno tune,,you can have a speed shop do it all including labor for under 2,000.00,,,,, or if you do not have the cash to spend,, you can do a full dyno tune and ad a Cold Air intake including labor for under 1,000.00


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## Guest (May 27, 2007)

*mods*

You can get a lot of good information from the people on this web site..and like I said before, when it comes to mods, you can go from MILD to WILD or you can just leave the car in Stock form.. The LS1's and LS2's are great motors in factory stock condition,,and they respond very well to minor changes,,if you plan on driving the car a lot,, leave the car stock or just add a few bolt on items,,you do not have to spend thousands to have a MEAN CAR,,you already are driving one..GOOD luck with your choice


DIZZY


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Bebensee said:


> Thats awesome. how much did the dealer charge you to put it on? How do you like it? Is there much gas milage differance?


Every dealer I checked with wanted the same (1000 – 1100) for installation. Afterwards, it was massively obvious that the power had increased throughout the RPM range. The other thing I noticed was, under normal driving, gas mileage actually improved by 1 to 2 miles per gallon. I have an auto and now get 17 city and 20.5 highway.

Honestly, it’s a little too loud for me, but everyone (including the service departments I’ve been to) always comment on how good it sounds. The rockers, surprisingly enough, roughen up the idle a bit and everyone asks what kind of CAM I have.

Still, you can get more of a gain for about 1000 less with a cam/head package. It comes down to; what you’re looking for now; how much additional power it will take to keep you happy; what your future plans are; and how important it is to keep your warranty and have the option of an extended warranty.

I have a video of the sound from inside the car, and pictures of the engine bay one year+ after install (shows how well the coating holds up). Let me know if you want me to post these up.


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## Devils3023 (May 21, 2007)

Hey, i was lookin into gettin this package so if you could post the videos and sound clips up that would be awesome!!!! thanks!!! :cheers


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

In car clipYou can hear how loud it is, but the camera didn't capture the drone, which is in the 2000 RPM range.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Headers after 6500 miles and 14 months.


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## Guest (May 28, 2007)

*455 Bob Cat*

I do not have any Video's or clips,, but if you want a good HP increase,, for less then then the price of the BOBCAT package,, you can do a CAM, exhaust and a Cold Air intake and end up with a killer package


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## Devils3023 (May 21, 2007)

Wow that sounds awesome!!!! The headers look great too after all the miles since installation. Thanks for the quick post of the vid and pic!!!! :cheers 
Have you had any problems since you got it installed? overheating, battery charging due to underdrive pulley etc....


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Devils3023 said:


> Wow that sounds awesome!!!! The headers look great too after all the miles since installation. Thanks for the quick post of the vid and pic!!!! :cheers
> Have you had any problems since you got it installed? overheating, battery charging due to underdrive pulley etc....


The battery died after sitting through a cold few weeks in winter, but that's not related to the kit. Other than that, my lights are a little dull at idle (the same as on my old muscle cars). I don’t know what 25% less charge would do if you had huge ass amps and all.

To be 100% honest, the only things you'll notice are:

- The sound
- Extra power
- The temp reading one notch lower
- An increased air sound from the air filter box
- And, for autos, firmer shifts 

Oh, but some people don't like the look of the SLP tips. Not that anyone has said it to me, but I have seen posts with that comment.

Still, even though this isn’t cheap (cost was a third concern of mine) you do keep your warranty. A blown anything in the driveline and you’ll be glad you’re covered.


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## silver04G-T-OHHH (Aug 13, 2006)

you can get a similar amount of power with cam, headers, catback and a dyno tune...the guy that said headers not needed is fu*king insane, the headers wake these cars up more than anything. not sure exactly where you are in illinois, but if you are in the northern part, I do installs in southeast wisconsin...pm me for any quotes you need.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Just remembered -- GM HightTech Performance, just a few months ago, evaluated all the popular packages. You should see about getting a back issue. I read it and it was very good to see all the options and the dyno results.

Edit:
Oh, one more thing; when I was checking into the Bobcat kit it was not required to have a dealer install it to keep your warranty. I see that Silver04 above is GM Certified, which was all they, meaning GM, required.


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## Devils3023 (May 21, 2007)

> The battery died after sitting through a cold few weeks in winter, but that's not related to the kit. Other than that, my lights are a little dull at idle (the same as on my old muscle cars). I don’t know what 25% less charge would do if you had huge ass amps and all.
> 
> To be 100% honest, the only things you'll notice are:
> 
> ...


Yeah, since mine is an a4 i was wondering how the transmission would react to the added power and if there were any problems when it shifted. Another thing is i have the full sap kit on my car and i see the slp exhaust is only single tip. do you think they'd be able to fab me some new dual/dual exhaust tips or would the ones that came with the sap kit fit over it? thanks for the info!!!!


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## Guest (May 28, 2007)

*Mods*

When you do Mods,, ask yourself one question.. do you plan on keeping the car for awhile,, at Trade in time,, dealers do not give a **** about mods, they will NOT add any Dollar value to the car,, and if you sell it yourself,, most people will not want a car car with MODS,, when they see mods they think the car has been beat, and in most cases they are right,,but if you plan on keeping it for a long time, it does not matter,, I have a few bolt on items and that is all I am doing, and I saved all my factory stuff... I found out a few weeks ago that my car is ONE of only 35 Built,, 2005 Yellow Jacket,, A/4 with 18 inch wheels


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Devils3023 said:


> Yeah, since mine is an a4 i was wondering how the transmission would react to the added power and if there were any problems when it shifted. Another thing is i have the full sap kit on my car and i see the slp exhaust is only single tip. do you think they'd be able to fab me some new dual/dual exhaust tips or would the ones that came with the sap kit fit over it? thanks for the info!!!!


Full SAP kit - sweet! You get the spoiler too?

The A4 is the is programmable; you will notice a massive difference in shift point at WOT, normal driving, and downshifts. As far as the tips, I honestly have no clue. SLP's tech support, although only open during business hours, is great for this type of question. I remember how much time they spent with me while I was trying to decide between the LM and LMII.

Now, let's see what happens - I've noticed Dizzy has to get the last word in on every post, even when he's the previous poster - lol. Any bets?


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## Devils3023 (May 21, 2007)

Yeah, the spoiler looks great on it....Ill probably give slp a call today and see what they can do for me because i don't wanna loose my dual/dual exhaust tips and it wouldn't look right w/ single tips cause of the way the rear sap fascia is designed... I think i'd get the loudmouth II exhaust because im not lookin to be obnoxiously loud, just heavier and beefier than stock- even though the sap kit adds different mufflers which makes it louder I just want it to growl a little more when i hit that gas!! :rofl:


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Devils3023 said:


> obnoxiously loud


It will still be very loud. The LMII gives the car a deeper sound, but still loud. It's not that 'open pipe' sound, but when you get on it everyone will know. Even though it's a little too loud for me, I still love it.


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## Devils3023 (May 21, 2007)

I called slp and they said they could do the install for me since there right in toms river, nj and im in wayne, nj so it's not that far. They said the sap dual/dual tips should be able to fit over the lmII exhaust so it's lookin like i might get this pretty soon. arty:


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## Bebensee (Oct 17, 2006)

Anyone have and Dyno numbers for the package? Looking to see how much I will gain with the A4. Im also pretty sure I should drive my car for more than a week before I start dropping thousands of dollars in MODS. but sitting over in the desert there isnt much else to think about.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

Bebensee said:


> Anyone have and Dyno numbers for the package? Looking to see how much I will gain with the A4. Im also pretty sure I should drive my car for more than a week before I start dropping thousands of dollars in MODS. but sitting over in the desert there isnt much else to think about.


http://www.gmhightechperformance.com/features/0703gm_budget_performance_parts/photo_09.html


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## BLACK05GTO (Feb 6, 2005)

SLP makes a good package, but for the money you could make a lot more power with a nice cam setup. 


I would start with long tube headers, intake, and a tune. For many, that's a perfect setup (about 30- 35 rwhp over stock). Then the next step up would be a cam package to meet your needs (60-90 rwhp over stock). 

Most the guys I know are making in the 415 - 425 rwhp range with those mods.

If you have an A4, you should definately add a converter.


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## BLACK05GTO (Feb 6, 2005)

dizzy1 said:


> Lets just say, if you add this package, you will walk all over a car with a supercharger and still have about $3,500.00 in your wallet,,, but the Loud mouth pipes are a little too loud for me



With the Bobcat 455 package you will get you axx handed to you by a GTO with a supercharger. 
I don't know where you got your information from. 

GTO's with the Bobcat 455 package are making around 375 rwhp.
GTO's with Procharger Superchargers are making around 490 rwhp. 


The last guy I saw at the track with the Bobcat 455 package was running high 12s @ 109 mph. The last guy I saw at the track in a Procharged GTO was running mid 11s @ 120 mph. 

The Bobcat 455 Package is basically long tube headers and a tune. The rest of the mods included in the package add very little additional HP (maybe 15 hp at most).


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

BLACK05GTO said:


> SLP makes a good package, but for the money you could make a lot more power with a nice cam setup.
> 
> 
> I would start with long tube headers, intake, and a tune. For many, that's a perfect setup (about 30- 35 rwhp over stock). Then the next step up would be a cam package to meet your needs (60-90 rwhp over stock).
> ...


With what you get though, you're not losing any low end torque. Max HP is just one measure of performance; where the torque peaks, how fast you hit that speed (rev time), are all just as important. As I've said, twice, you can make more for less if your only concern is HP, but you can have this and keep your warranty, increase torque throughout the RPM range, and improve your gas mileage slightly. If those are secondary and HP per dollar is the primary metric, the SLP kit is not what you’re looking for.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

BLACK05GTO said:


> With the Bobcat 455 package you will get you axx handed to you by a GTO with a supercharger.
> I don't know where you got your information from.
> 
> GTO's with the Bobcat 455 package are making around 375 rwhp.
> ...


The bobcat kit is actually at 390 RWHP. This has been confirmed numerous times. You can get more if you tweak the tune though. Also, did you see the ATI 11 sec run on the same day as the SLP 12 sec run and do you know the drivers’ skills? Did one have, oh say, sticky tires? The SLP should be a solid mid to low mid 12s car. You can’t throw out the best time for one and worse for the other to prove a point.

I agree that the ATI car will kill the Bobcat kit 100% unless the ATI guy can't drive worth a **** and the SLP guy can. I'm just asking for clarification.


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## Guest (Jun 3, 2007)

*Slp*

The SLP is a good package but not worth the price, same goes for the Super Charger , good item but not woth the price,, THe SLP with installation and tune is well over 4,000.00 and the MAGGI with install and tune is about 7,500.00... I purchased a SLP but then I turned around and sold part of it on ebay,, the Loud Mouth pipes were TOO loud for me,,Kept the under drive pulley, kept the 160 thermostat, and sold the rest,

go with a good cam package and exhaust,,


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## BLACK05GTO (Feb 6, 2005)

Mike_V said:


> The bobcat kit is actually at 390 RWHP. This has been confirmed numerous times. You can get more if you tweak the tune though. Also, did you see the ATI 11 sec run on the same day as the SLP 12 sec run and do you know the drivers’ skills? Did one have, oh say, sticky tires? The SLP should be a solid mid to low mid 12s car. You can’t throw out the best time for one and worse for the other to prove a point.
> 
> I agree that the ATI car will kill the Bobcat kit 100% unless the ATI guy can't drive worth a **** and the SLP guy can. I'm just asking for clarification.



You might get 390 rwhp with the 455 Package. But most the guys I know with LS2 M6 GTO's are making in the 360 - 380 rwhp with just an intake, long tube headers, and a tune. 

On average a Procharged LS2 GTO will make 100 rwhp more than the Bobcat 455 setup. 
For anyone to say the Bobcat 455 setup will make a GTO faster than a supercharger setup is ridiculous.
I would love for you guys to post this over in LS1GTO.com to see what kind of comments you get.

Bobcat 455 vs Supercharging -which makes more power and produces faster track times.


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## Guest (Jun 3, 2007)

*headers*



Mike_V said:


> Headers after 6500 miles and 14 months.


are you using the stock plug wires, in the photo you can see the stock spark pug shields


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

BLACK05GTO said:


> You might get 390 rwhp with the 455 Package. But most the guys I know with LS2 M6 GTO's are making in the 360 - 380 rwhp with just an intake, long tube headers, and a tune.
> 
> On average a Procharged LS2 GTO will make 100 rwhp more than the Bobcat 455 setup.
> For anyone to say the Bobcat 455 setup will make a GTO faster than a supercharger setup is ridiculous.
> ...


1. You get the 390 without tweaking the tune (Safe=less). 
2. I never said a supercharged GTO wouldn't beat the 455. I agree with you.



dizzy1 said:


> are you using the stock plug wires, in the photo you can see the stock spark pug shields


Yes, stock plug wires. For the length they flow just fine.

You guys are missing my point though, I have a warranty with no questions asked besides "did I have it installed by a GM shop and do I have the paperwork". After that's cleared up they start with "damn that sounds good", "wow that's bad ass", "damn them some high quality parts and good package".

There's no way I'd say this package is for everyone, but it's a good option for some.


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## Guest (Jun 4, 2007)

*455*

on the street the super charged cars are not at any big advantage over a non Super charged motor,, what I mean by this is a few weeks ago I watched an 04 with Maggi do a 12.4,, about 1 second faster then a stocker..1 second means crap on the street


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

dizzy1 said:


> on the street the super charged cars are not at any big advantage over a non Super charged motor,, what I mean by this is a few weeks ago I watched an 04 with Maggi do a 12.4,, about 1 second faster then a stocker..1 second means crap on the street


If you have a Maggi you better have launching down. Way fun, but not the best choice IMHO. A ProCharger, however, is another beast entirely. It adds the power where the car can use it. Still, for any of these you're talking about 30% of the car's value said and done. Really hard to justify that just to lose your license that much faster.


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2007)

*mods*

yeah.. your are talking about spending way over 7,500, for a Maggie,,, you can get a lot more HP for a lot less money by going with a good cam and package,,, and come trade in time of selling out right, you will get screwed


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

dizzy1 said:


> on the street the super charged cars are not at any big advantage over a non Super charged motor,, what I mean by this is a few weeks ago I watched an 04 with Maggi do a 12.4,, about 1 second faster then a stocker..1 second means crap on the street


I have let a lot of your posts pass but this won't make it. But before I start I know for a fact that you dislike superchargers. How do I know? Because you have NEVER said anything nice about them. You hate 'em and that's your choice. But you have got to be kidding me if you think that the Bobcat 455 will outperform a superchargered GTO on the street or the track for that matter. *Yeah it's true that any car on any day can outrun the next regardless of power or the driver.* But to make a bold statement like you did in the post you deleted is ridiculous. I wish I lived closed to you to see just how great of a racer you are. I admit I suck as a racer but I'm always willing to race non-believers like yourself. 

And where are you getting your info from. A stock '04 running 13.4? Have you performed this feat or did you see, in person, someone else in a showroom stock '04 run that time? If not, speculation means nothing. And for you to claim to know a lot about racing, why would you say a second means nothing on the street. If it's about winning, .001 of second means something. And who races a 1/4 mile on the street? Certainly not me. 

Come on man keep it real.


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2007)

*to EVERYONE*

I have a set of 455 BOBCAT fender badges,, anyone want them.. FREE


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2007)

6QTS11OZ said:


> I have let a lot of your posts pass but this won't make it. But before I start I know for a fact that you dislike superchargers. How do I know? Because you have NEVER said anything nice about them. You hate 'em and that's your choice. But you have got to be kidding me if you think that the Bobcat 455 will outperform a superchargered GTO on the street or the track for that matter. *Yeah it's true that any car on any day can outrun the next regardless of power or the driver.* But to make a bold statement like you did in the post you deleted is ridiculous. I wish I lived closed to you to see just how great of a racer you are. I admit I suck as a racer but I'm always willing to race non-believers like yourself.
> 
> And where are you getting your info from. A stock '04 running 13.4? Have you performed this feat or did you see, in person, someone else in a showroom stock '04 run that time? If not, speculation means nothing. And for you to claim to know a lot about racing, why would you say a second means nothing on the street. If it's about winning, .001 of second means something. And who races a 1/4 mile on the street? Certainly not me.
> 
> Come on man keep it real.


Superchargers are OK but not for me, I can get the same HP for a few thousand less. and I watched the 04 go a 13.4 ,


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

dizzy1 said:


> yeah.. your are talking about spending way over 7,500, for a Maggie,,, you can get a lot more HP for a lot less money by going with a good cam and package,,, and come trade in time of selling out right, you will get screwed


Does it really matter what power adder someone chooses to get. If you can afford it or it's your preference it doesn't matter what someone else says about how you choose to spend you cash... does it? You really need to chill with the s/c bashing because you really haven't given a good reason why someone should choose a different package over it. And what facts do you have that someone would be screwed come trade in time or selling right out if you have a supercharger?


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2007)

*mods*

My 05 went 11.9 at 121MPH a few weeks ago,, not Great but not to shabby because it only has a few bolt on items,, and it will be in the shop in the next several days for a COMP custom grind cam, roller rockers and brace, push rods, some head work and one or two more small items. I wanted to do more but here in Connecticut, the land of 55MPH speed limits and Auto emmission testing..and running out of places to turn the HP loose, why bother,,


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

dizzy1 said:


> Superchargers are OK but not for me, I can get the same HP for a few thousand less. and I watched the 04 go a 13.4 ,


See to me that's fine. Should I bash you for going a different route than what I chose... No! More power to you. It's a GTO you're doing it to so you'll automatically get props from me.


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## PC4STOP (Sep 3, 2006)

dizzy1 said:


> *Superchargers are OK but not for me, I can get the same HP for a few thousand less*. and I watched the 04 go a 13.4 ,





dizzy1 said:


> yeah.. your are talking about spending way over 7,500, for a Maggie,,, you can get a lot more HP for a lot less money by going with a good cam and package,,, and come trade in time of selling out right, you will get screwed


You my friend need to check your facts. I am curious what heads, cam package you are going to put in you car and spend a couple thousand less doing it to make 490 or more whp. Keeping in mind all the supporting mods you will also have to install to make the power.

:cheers


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## Guest (Jun 5, 2007)

*mods*

It may sound like bashing put it is not,,that what i like about this forum,, everyone gets to speak or type what they feel,,, I don't have a need for a 600 HP car,, not in Connecticut,, 55 MPH speed limits, emmission testing and very small rds,, no place to turn the sucker loose,, I have to take back part of that statement, I already have a car with over 600 HP.. it sits in the garage, not much use since the Dragway closed down in 1984 , closest one now is about 2 hours away, went there a few weeks ago only to see 5 million Jap tuners and only a handful of American goodies, my other car is a 67 Camaro, I bought it new in 67 from Cooley Chevy in New Haven . it was called a Black Panther Camaro, a special package that the dealer prepped..I took it to Baldwin Motion in L.I so they could work their wonders,, 427, L88 open chambered heads,full roller set up, just too much to mention, and the gearing just to much for the street, 513's,, Doug Nash 5 speed,, old school stuff


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

Come on dizzy. In your other thread about non-GM cars you were talking about handing the drivers their heads. Are you only racing them to 55?  

You don't have to answer that. I'm just busting your chops. :cheers


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

dizzy1 said:


> My 05 went 11.9 at 121MPH a few weeks ago


Sure it did


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

This thread is crazy. 

455 = good enough for me and my warranty
Cam, head, bolt ons = better 
Maggi = out of control fun
ProCharger = Rocket

What’s there to discuss. Oh, and a GTO with a few mods running a near ZO6 quarter, hmm.


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

Mike_V said:


> This thread is crazy.
> 
> 455 = good enough for me and my warranty
> Cam, head, bolt ons = better
> ...


If that's true. 11.9 seems doable. But a trap speed of 121 at that time seems way off. And before anyone starts tripping, I did use the word "seems" which is not saying it didn't happen.

And for those who don't know, a Maggie does not void your warranty and Magnuson stands behind that. Plus it's C.A.R.B. legal (E0: D-488-10) as long as the boost output remains at 6 psi. Here's a link if you don't believe me; http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/aftermkteo.php Does the SLP 455 Bobcat package have a C.A.R.B. number? 

Also you WILL void your warranty with the 455 Bobcat package. 
1) You're relocating (since you're getting long tubes) and changing the factory cats with hi-flow cats. A definite no-no. The cats have to remain the same and in the same factory location when their changed. Plus you're breaking a Federal law by changing stock cats that are not defective. Do some research because that is true.
2) What do you think the dealership will say if you blow the engine and they see aftermarket 1.85 rocker arms under you valve cover. You don't think they will weasel out of changing your engine... FOR FREE!  
3) Same as #2. What will the dealership say when they see the stock tuning has been changed to the DiabloSport 2's program.

Don't kid yourselves if you think your warranty won't be voided with the 455 Bobcat package. If you want to be sure call a dealership and discuss those above 3 things with them and let us know what they say. If the dealership does warranty it it damn sure won't be emissions legal.

If 455 "crank" horsepower is good enough for you then that's fine. I wanted 500 "rwhp" and that's good enough or me... for now  . To each his/her own though. It's your money, spend it any way you choose.


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## AA GTO SP (Nov 11, 2006)

6QTS11OZ said:


> 3) Same as #2. What will the dealership say when they see the stock tuning has been changed to the DiabloSport 2's program.


Not to put any gasoline in the fire, but I'm honestly confused about this. Does this mean it voids warranty to tune youre car, or is diablosport2 more serious?


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## Red Bearded Goat (Mar 19, 2007)

6QTS11OZ said:


> Also you WILL void your warranty with the 455 Bobcat package.
> 1) You're relocating (since you're getting long tubes) and changing the factory cats with hi-flow cats. A definite no-no. The cats have to remain the same and in the same factory location when their changed. Plus you're breaking a Federal law by changing stock cats that are not defective. Do some research because that is true.
> 2) What do you think the dealership will say if you blow the engine and they see aftermarket 1.85 rocker arms under you valve cover. You don't think they will weasel out of changing your engine... FOR FREE!
> 3) Same as #2. What will the dealership say when they see the stock tuning has been changed to the DiabloSport 2's program.
> ...


The stand alone Pontiac only, no other brand of new cars or trucks dealership I bought my GTO at had been installing the 455 Bobcat package in new cars and selling them with a slight mark up for the trouble until they sold out their GTO inventory. They had one 455 package remaining when my car was transferred in from another dealer and they asked if I wanted it installed before delivery. 

Like all warranty issues, service will be based on how good a dealer's service department is and what the mind set is at a specific dealership in how they treat their customers.

My state has emissions testing at state run facilities only. With the level of education being a HS diploma at best to work at the testing station, I strongly doubt they would pick up the cats are different from the OEM. They go about a robotic procedure of looking at a fixed mirror on the curb that reflects the cars underside to check the exhaust system components, look at the filler neck and put a test plug in to check its the proper diameter before doing one of 3 types of tests that are dependent on when the car or truck had been built. Being post 1997 or so they do a non running diagnostic test with their computer looking for faults. Having a tune other then factory could cause the car to be flagged, but I do not know enough about the testing data they collect to say for certain. I can tell you a state run station is a joke after driving my 84 GMC K2500 4x4 thru a few years back and passed the treadmill test with a leaking passenger bank that made it sound like I was running open headers because they only sniffed the drivers bank of the custom dual exhaust (no crossover) system installed. I put turn outs on to make it hard on em and they were too lazy to run the extra plumbing to get a proper sample. He did scratch his head at the smoke coming from under the hood as I revved it to leave with a s*** eatin grin on my mug because it passed. I only went in to avoid a late fee if I didn't take it in by the deadline date and never thought it would pass like that. 

Luck o the draw that day, but an example of its not always the law but who's enforcing it that makes the difference, just like standing behind the warranty.

Red Beard


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

AA GTO SP said:


> Not to put any gasoline in the fire, but I'm honestly confused about this. Does this mean it voids warranty to tune youre car, or is diablosport2 more serious?


Any manufacturer of an aftermarket part that alters the factory emissions level must meet the EPA process of self-certifying its parts to not be worse than the factory's emissions. If a technician is not competent enough to recognize that a tune in the ECU is not the factory tune then I guess you'll get away with one. But if he can prove that the tune was altered and it does not meet mandated EPA criteria for emissions then the dealership can void your warranty. Unless it's put on a sniffer they probably will never know a different tune is in there.

Plain and simple. If the Diablo's tune allows more pollutants to be released into the air than the stock tune then your warranty can be voided. Now if the 455 Bobcat came with a C.A.R.B. EO# then you'll be good to go with minimal problems. And I say minimal because some dealerships will still find a reason screw you over.


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

When you get the kit installed it has the same 3/36 warranty as the car - it mirrors the GM warranty. The car's sold with that kit by the dealer, and now it's considered new 'as purchased' equipment. Even if you don't pass emissions all you need is a work order from the dealer stating the car is as it was when purchased and you will be issued a waiver. That's only if you fail, which you will not. A CARB # is for CA only, and I’d like to see any long tubes with a carb#.

SLP and GM go way back, and the firehawk was huge. As far as dealers installing crap and warranty/emission issues, how about the intake for the Solstice, the GM performance supercharger for the 2.x echotech. You can order anything GM approves or sells, have it installed by the dealer/GM Tech, and it will have a warranty for the part and not void the vehicle’s warranty.

6Q - you should really do a little more research before making blanket, uninformed statements. I’m not trying to be a ‘shyit’, but the facts are the facts. Tons of people on here have had this installed by the dealer or purchased the car with it already installed. I have yet to see a single post regarding warranty issues – not a one.


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

Mike_V said:


> When you get the kit installed it has the same 3/36 warranty as the car - it mirrors the GM warranty. The car's sold with that kit by the dealer, and now it's considered new 'as purchased' equipment. Even if you don't pass emissions all you need is a work order from the dealer stating the car is as it was when purchased and you will be issued a waiver. That's only if you fail, which you will not. A CARB # is for CA only, and I’d like to see any long tubes with a carb#.
> 
> SLP and GM go way back, and the firehawk was huge. As far as dealers installing crap and warranty/emission issues, how about the intake for the Solstice, the GM performance supercharger for the 2.x echotech. You can order anything GM approves or sells, have it installed by the dealer/GM Tech, and it will have a warranty for the part and not void the vehicle’s warranty.
> 
> 6Q - you should really do a little more research before making blanket, uninformed statements. I’m not trying to be a ‘shyit’, but the facts are the facts. Tons of people on here have had this installed by the dealer or purchased the car with it already installed. I have yet to see a single post regarding warranty issues – not a one.


Well, guess what? I have done some research. Also for your information, I am certified with California's Air Resources Board (you've heard of them-C.A.R.B.) to perform Visible Emissions Evaluations which means that I know a few things about emission sources whether it's a car or a broiler exhaust stack on the top of a Burger King. And that's not just smoke, no pun intended, that I'm blowing up your butt. PM *gm4life* or *bluhaven* if you need confirmation. Or if you like, log onto LS1GTO.COM and pm *btlfed1500* if you need someone else's approval of what I do. 

Now read thru this pdf. from the UNITED STATES EPA (not just C.A.R.B.) and tell me if I was wrong in the info I told you about emissions. Plus here in Cali you DO NOT get a waiver. You pass emissions or you don't drive (because your registration will not be renewed)... PERIOD! And long tubes are not legal here in Cali and some other states because of the reasons I spoke of in my previous post (because long tubes relocate the cats to a position other than the stock location). 

http://www.epa.gov/OMS/cert/factshts/catcvrts.pdf

If you don't have the time to read everything, scroll down to (11), the last 2 paragraphs and tell me if you think a dealership is willing to get fined for $25,000 for installing high flow cats that are incorrect and in a location other than the factory position for you. As far as the dealership honoring your factory warranty because they installed incorrect smog equipment in a different location, well, that may be true. But it's still illegal!! You better hope that you and your dealership aren't exposed by a competent smog or test only station.

I'm going to bed now so I'll check your response in the morning to see if you still feel the same way you did in your last post.

Good night :cheers


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

You're 100% correct regarding CA, and other states, requirements, fines, and everything in that document. I trust you know your stuff top to bottom in that area. Thank god I'll never have to deal with CA laws.

Everyone always needs to check local laws before they do anything. My primary point was regarding the warranty.

That said, I guess you always pass your emission testing - haha - good deal.


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## 6QTS11OZ (Mar 27, 2005)

Mike_V said:


> You're 100% correct regarding CA, and other states, requirements, fines, and everything in that document.  I trust you know your stuff top to bottom in that area. Thank god I'll never have to deal with CA laws.
> 
> Everyone always needs to check local laws before they do anything. My primary point was regarding the warranty.
> 
> That said, I guess you always pass your emission testing - haha - good deal.


Yeah living in California does limit some of the things that we can do to our rides. I'm not even sure which turbo kits we can get because they're not all C.A.R.B. legal, if any.  And to be honest with you, I probably only know about 10% of this California Air Resources Board and emissions crap. It's good stuff to know though but boy it will consume you if you let it. Thankfully I'm not out hugging every tree I see... unless it has a nice hole in it.  

I guess the warranty thing is hit and miss. Some dealerships reminds me of traffic cops. Depending on what mood they're in will determine if you get warranty work done/a warning ticket or you'll have to foot the repair bill/you're getting a ticket.

Me always pass emissions? :lol: Well with the current set up I have know, I will easily pass the sniffer portion of the test with flying colors. The visual will have me removing a few parts... temporarily 

Take care! :cheers


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## Mike_V (Mar 10, 2006)

6QTS11OZ said:


> Thankfully I'm not out hugging every tree I see... unless it has a nice hole in it.


lol - you're crazy - :rofl: I bet splinters hurt like hell down there. 

:cheers


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