# 400 dip stick tube



## jesserettele (Aug 23, 2008)

The repalcement dip stick tube is in three pieces and Ames doesn't seem to have a text book answer as to how far the center tube installs into the block. I didn't see the factory one before the machine shop so I have no clue Any ideas out there?


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

On most tubes that instal into a block, if there is a crimp or a raised/rib section of the tube near one end, then it gets pushed in all the way till that crimp hits the block.


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## jesserettele (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks, I appreciate the info. 

I was hoping that this tube assembly had a crimped section similar to others but it did not. The machined section of the block for the tube housing is the same diameter all the way through the block. The outside of the intermediate tube housing is also smooth with no raise or crimp. The housing has to be installed from inside the oil pan out. 

I am unclear about how far the intermediate tube housing is installed into the block. I can't find a decent motor rebuild manual that explains this in detail. I have attached a few pics to try and clarify.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

It`s been years sence I had the pan off mine, but isn`t there a windage tray that belongs on there?? And I think the tube inside the motor should bolt to one of the main caps? It looks like maybe you have the wrong tube?


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Yes, there should be a windage tray!!! That tube is held in PLACE by the windage tray. Also, with the windage tray bolted to the main caps, the tube kind of only fits in one way: it self positions. So, you need to get an early, full length windage tray and go from there. You DO NOT want to run with out one (Oil foaming/crankshaft drag/HP loss, etc.) It's there for good reasons!!!!


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## jesserettele (Aug 23, 2008)

Thanks that was it! I found one, had it cleaned up, and installed it tonight. You were right the lower tube can only go in one position and it has to go between the block and windage tray. The lower tube has a small crimp on it that presses on the windage tray and that is what prevents it from falling down as well as tells you how far the intermediate tube needs to be installed into the block.

You guys have any tips from experience that I could make sure I pay attention to in order to avoid any other problems/holdups? I should have signed up here months ago.


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## geeteeohguy (Feb 2, 2008)

Yeah.....be really meticulous installing the rear main seal (graphite impregnated rope), or spend the $$ on a Vitron rear main seal. Also, use engine oil with ZDDP or a ZDDP additive. Today, that means diesel rated fleet oil. Automotive oil had the ZDDP removed two years ago, and camshafts have been going flat ever since. Other than that, Pontiac engines are really strong running, basic, good engines. They make a lot of power for their size and are reliable. They tend to run on the hot side (210 is normal in summer), and they like HIGH OCTANE fuel, unless you run low compression. Have fun!
Jeff


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## 70gto (Mar 19, 2008)

Watch how accurate that oil stick is , after adding the correct amount of oil and starting it , mine is from year one, and it is incorrect, shows low side with correct amount of oil.


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## jesserettele (Aug 23, 2008)

70gto said:


> Watch how accurate that oil stick is , after adding the correct amount of oil and starting it , mine is from year one, and it is incorrect, shows low side with correct amount of oil.


What should I use to validate or gauge the correct amount of oil for the first time with this dipstick tube?


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## jesserettele (Aug 23, 2008)

geeteeohguy said:


> Yeah.....be really meticulous installing the rear main seal (graphite impregnated rope), or spend the $$ on a Vitron rear main seal. Also, use engine oil with ZDDP or a ZDDP additive. Today, that means diesel rated fleet oil. Automotive oil had the ZDDP removed two years ago, and camshafts have been going flat ever since. Other than that, Pontiac engines are really strong running, basic, good engines. They make a lot of power for their size and are reliable. They tend to run on the hot side (210 is normal in summer), and they like HIGH OCTANE fuel, unless you run low compression. Have fun!
> Jeff


What does ZDDP acronym stand for? This 400 ci has a roller camshaft kit also. Thanks for the pointers.


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## Rukee (Feb 8, 2007)

jesserettele said:


> What should I use to validate or gauge the correct amount of oil for the first time with this dipstick tube?


The first time you run the engine, be sure to fill with 6qts. Then after running, shut the engine down and check the oil. It should read full, if not then mark the stick were it is and then that's your new full mark.




jesserettele said:


> What does ZDDP acronym stand for? This 400 ci has a roller camshaft kit also. Thanks for the pointers.


If you have a roller cam then no worries about what it is.


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## 44knuck (Jan 3, 2009)

Hello - Im new to the GTO Forum and found these posts very useful - Im in the process of rebuilding a 72 LeMans - I tore the motor apart and had the long block built and assembled.

My issue is now putting the odds and ends (oil pump - water pump etc) back and the dip stick tube assy is causing some concern - my question is should the tube that is external to the block supposed to insert into the tube that is internal (connecting inside the hole in the block - I had these parts hot dipped and they will not connect - I appreciate any help - Im thinking the hot dip may have caused some problems...


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## 44knuck (Jan 3, 2009)

*Dip stick tubes continued*

Hello - just joined the GTO Forum and found these posts useful.

Im rebuilding the orig 350 in my 72 LeMans. I had the long block done professionaly and now doing the final assy - I have a question on the dip stick tube assy.

I had these parts hot dipped - they look like they should insert into each other (the internal tube and the external tube) where they insert into the hole in the block.

They dont insert into each other and Im wondering if this will cause leaks and/or if I should find some new tubes before going any further...

Any help would be appreciated...


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## wytnyt (May 17, 2008)

pic of where mine wanted to go in order for tray to ine up
also freezing the tube makes for easier install







[/IMG]


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## 44knuck (Jan 3, 2009)

WYTNYT - Thanks for the pic - freezing is easy Im working in my Colorado garage and its about 15 outside and maybe 30 in the garage

The big question is the windage tray - and how the heck the tube is inserted - there are 3 diameters on the tube and a flange before the tube bends - i assume the tube goes into the windage tray from the bottom side (and is held in place between the block and the flange - then the long straight part comes out of the windage tay and points into the oil pan area (who designs this stuff) 

At this point I am looking for a replacement assy - I think mine as well as the windage tray may have been damaged in the hot tank when they dipped the parts - should go together much easier I think...

Thanks for the assist - I will keep at it...


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## 44knuck (Jan 3, 2009)

Well I think I have it figured out - for future needs the photo WYTNYT posted is correct and I was all messed up.

The tube i was thinking extended into the oil pan area is the tube he posted that is called the lower tube - the upper tube inserts into this lower tube and mounts to the block (the lower tube is pressed into the block as shown) the 3rd tube is the small bent tube and inserts into the lower tube and into the hole in the windage tray - the crimped end closest to the windage tray.

Thanks for the help...


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